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They're not replacement panels as such - if you want an AR coated panel you'll have to buy one.

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I'll reiterate that this is just completely wrong. Mk.I users all had AR panels, and since putting a non-AR panel in an automobile seems inconceivable, it was safe to assume for us that the Mk.II would ALSO have AR panels. This IS a design flaw, not a "feature", and should be treated as such.

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AR isn't mentioned anywhere in the product description.

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No, but one might also note (I haven't done the research yet), that when you listed off the many times "what's changed from Mk.I to Mk.II" that you never mentioned that the AR coating was being removed, in which case, the AR coating was implied by its lack of mention in that context.

Furthermore, even if the AR wasn't mentioned, the tuner was, so was voice recognition, and we've been notoriously patient about letting Empeg slide on these two topics. For you to sit there and point to the marketing materials as the Holy Scripture of what you have to provide and then forget that you're NOT currently providing what the marketing materials say you will provide. (For example, if you're going to play that game, then I want my FM Tuner _TODAY_, not next week, not next month, TODAY, because the marketing materials say, and I quote:

The player has a modular tuner interface, for which an FM module is initially available. The FM module includes RDS (Radio Data System) for station naming, auto re-tuning and traffic announcements - RDS stations are commonplace in Europe and steadily increasing in the USA.

You are directly claiming that it IS available, not that it will be available at some future date.

Empeg has a long history of "doing the right thing" in terms of customer service, but to tell us that you don't owe us AR panels because you didn't promise them to us, despite the fact that it would have been an obvious assumption (based both on experience with the Mk.I, and with knowledge that real-world needs dictated AR panels), just seems to go completely against everything I have ever thought about your committment to service.

I have to be honest when I say that this situation would give me cause to SERIOUSLY rethink my preaching of the unit to co-workers and friends, because Empeg is completely dropping the ball on a serious customer service issue. Yes, I understand the AR panels cost more, but - really - that is NOT our problem. That's Empeg's problem for not designing the unit right the first time.

Empeg's behaviour in this would be like Firestone demanding that people pay money to exchange the tires on their Ford Explorers. It's just ludicrous.

D

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Go buy a Sony or some other brand player and see if they will update you device when they make a design change!!

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This is less of a "design change" as a "design flaw", and you can bet that Sony would never dream of shipping stuff without AR panels, because they know that -- DUH -- cars are exposed to the sun, the sun is bright, and the screen needs to be anti-reflective.

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And besides they're still a very small company just trying to get started.

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... and making very bad customer-service decisions isn't going to get them any larger.

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Do you want to kill them off and the empegCar along with it?

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No, but if replacing $30 parts is going to kill them off, they're far closer to oblivion than I can affect in any way.

D

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This is less of a "design change" as a "design flaw", and you can bet that Sony would never dream of shipping stuff without AR panels, because they know that -- DUH -- cars are exposed to the sun, the sun is bright, and the screen needs to be anti-reflective.

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Just the record, my blue empeg w/o AR coating is MUCH easier to read in the sunlight then my sony cd player..
-mark

MK2: 36gb
Tivo: 90gb
CPU: 120gb
...I think drive manufacturers love me!

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And if you think empeg is not doing it's job you get me a software upgrade for my Nokia 7110, that thing crashes more then an XT trying to run Windows 2000 ...
The software for my empeg is just a click away ... Maybe some things got delayed, maybe some things are not on it that you took for granted ... But then in a few months it will have all that was promised and more so stop you bellyaching.

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Who said anything about software? Software is (generally) a "Cost-less" proposition (except where additional licensing/re-licensing fees are necessary, as in the case of the audio formats Rob and co. are talking about). I would expect (and indeed, get - kudos to Empeg on this front) software updates for free unless I'm paying for some new feature (WMA, for example, although I'm not sure if that has a license fee associated with it) that I didn't previously have.

If you have a phone whose display is consistently unreadable, though, you would take it back to the vendor/mfr, and expect them to replace or repair it to make it readable. THAT's what we're talking about here that the Empeg folks are (apparently) not willing to do.

D

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The only reason you consider it to be defective is because they're planning on shipping a better version.

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No, actually, I've been saying it right along. I'm one of the people who got them LOOKING at replacing the AR in the first place.

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Your other point is well taken- is it cheaper to send out a bunch of $30.00 parts or to take returns on a $1500.00 product? That's really the root of the problem. Companies have to take cold, hard looks at questions like that. How likely will they get returns from customers in sunny climates? Are they willing to risk alienating customers and potential customers over it?

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Actually, the real math works out to:

Where n(R) is the number of returns, and n(S) is the number sold:

Is ( 1500*n(R) > 30*n(S) )

If the answer is yes, then the math is an easy no-brainer. You do it, because, for no other reason, sending the hardware is a mathematical success.

Where the above equation is NOT true, then you have to modify it to include n(pS), the number of POTENTIAL (but lost) sales and do:

( 1500*(n(R)+n(pS)) > 30*n(S) )

In THAT scenario, it almost always works out to be beneficial to send the replacement hardware as well.

On the issue of inventory... that's a whole different thing... saying "we've got these coming, and we're trying to ration everything so that we minimize the number of non-AR panels that go out on units, while still replacing the non-AR's that are out there at no charge, so it may take longer to get it to you". That's a FAR cry from what we're hearing now, which is "bite us, if you don't like the non-AR, cough up currency".

D