I am now making smoke and clear faceplates for Mark I models with Mark II/Rio models soon to follow.

They are $20 US a piece plus $2 US postage to most places.

Anyone that interested email darkstorm@bellsouth.net with quantity, shipping address, color (smoke or clear) and whether you need Mark I or Mark II faceplate/lenses (remember Mark II/Rio lenses are still in design stage at the moment).

Payments will be accepted at Paypal.com using drkstorm@bellsouth.net or if you don't have Paypal include that in your email and we'll find a different method of payment.

I've included a picture of the smoke tinted one I made for my Mark I on a cnc router that I operate at work.

Steve

How do they hold up during normal operating conditions (direct sunlight, etc)? I know there was some controvery because the normal colored ones from empeg have been carefully picked to emphasize the brightness as much as possible, while the AR coating cuts down on glare from the sun.

I'd be interested in one, but only if the display didn't totally get washed out when the sun directly hit it.

(O|||||O)

You should find the result quite viewable under all but very bright sunlight (which will wash out any display technology, really).
The coloured panels cut a lot of intensity, and the AR coating is required to make the most of what you've got left.

I have a clear empeg panel, one of the very original test samples we had made during the development to check what the
thing would look like, and the display is very bright indeed with it on. In fact, in the dark, it lights the entire room up.

Patrick.

Opinions expressed in this email may contain up to 42% water by weight, and are mine. All mine.

Can you explain the "smoke" panels? Is it similar to the AR stuff that's on the colored plates available from Empeg? The picture isn't clear enough to be able to tell how much it diffuses the screen... The Empeg AR panels are still relatively crisp as far as the individual pixels go. If the smoke effect isn't too drastic, I think I'd love one of these for my MkII, because the VFD color is closer to my instrumentation than the blue or green plates.

-Tony
MkII #554

Greetings!

I don't suppose Rio / empeg would like to release these (clear / smoke / neutral) panels as an option... There appears to be a demand. I already ordered my set, but would still like an official empeg / Rio version with RF coating if it ever became available.

Paul G.
SN# 090000587 (40GB Green)

What-r-ya doin bud? Tryin to kill my business? :)

HAHAHAHA! Actually, I don't think it likely. I remember this discussion on the board a while back, and I do not think clear / smoke / neutral will ever come into being as a profitable faceplate alternative. Unless Rio decides to try and color match to US dash lighting...

Paul G.
SN# 090000587 (40GB Green)

When will the Mk. II ones be ready?

I am hoping by the end of next week I will be sending them out, but we'll see.

Steve

One thing that did occur to me: The original MK1 panels include an IR filter over the
IRDA and consumer IR sensors to prevent spurious signals interfering with
non-spurious ones. Under some circumstances, if this filter isn't present, the
remote control can become unreliable. It might be worth thinking about...

Patrick.


Opinions expressed in this email may contain up to 42% water by weight, and are mine. All mine.

I haven't run into any problems with this.

Boy, It almost seems like some of you are against the idea of a clear faceplate.

Steve

Huh? Against the idea? Chill out dude... I think we've just got legitimate questions for something that we could be paying 20 bones for. You've quite generously offered to make clear faceplates, and we've quite reasonably asked questions about the product. What's the problem?

Still didn't answer my question about the "smoke" panels. Is the smoke effect similar to the A/R faceplates?

-Tony
MkII #554

Don't get me wrong, I'm not being hostile. It just seems that some of the questions being asked are rather obvious. I am an individual that happens to use a CNC router during my daily job.
I'm not a company like SonicBlue/Empeg so I won't have access to AR coatings or filters for the IR led.

I haven't run in to any problems with the IR being affected. Nothing else triggers it and the remote still works fine.

The display is absolutely crystal clear and is pretty readable in most sunlight THOUGH very very bright & direct sunlight does wash it out but to quote what Patrick (pca) said earlier "You should find the result quite viewable under all but very bright sunlight (which will wash out any display technology, really)"

And as far as the price, $20 is not a hell of a lot of money which $15 of which is what I got my boss to let me use the machine and have the material a piece for plus $5 for my time for doing it. I don't think it's unreasonable.

Steve

I forgot to answer your question.
I'm not sure what you mean by is it similar to the AR coating.

They are clear (i.e. completely see-through) but tinted like sunglasses are.

Steve

Boy, It almost seems like some of you are against the idea of a clear faceplate.

I wasn't trying to be an ass or anything by asking about what the faceplates look like under sunlight... I drive a Jeep and when the top is off and the sun is directly on the unit, I just wanted to know if the screen is even readable at all.

I'm just a possible consumer asking questions about a product he might purchase. Sorry if you took it the wrong way.

(O|||||O)

They're nothing against you, I've just seen a couple of posts that seem (to me at least) that some are trying to talk others out of it and it rubs me the wrong way you know? I posted a picture which seems to be pretty clear to me, so let people make their own choices, after all it's not like I'm asking $150 for these things.

Anyway back to your question, under direct bright sunlight it does wash out but like 'pca' pointed out direct bright sunlight will wash out pretty much anything.

Let me know,
Steve

Greetings!

Having already committed to two faceplates, I can honestly say that I don't think anyone is trying to talk you out of making them. Everyone just has questions about how they work, what they will look like, etc. My concern was for the RF coating - I bring my empeg into the office every day, and the last thing I need is to have the empeg cause interference with any equipment there.

My recommendation is that anyone purchasing a plate take a photo and give a description of what kind of experience they have had. If you (the potential purchaser) are "on the fence" about it, just wait to see what the photos / stories have to say. Steve - thanks for going through the trouble of making these! I really think I will get a better match.

This also means that, after having purchased two new faceplates, if empeg / Rio comes out with "official" coated displays that I would buy theirs as well. I want to collect the whole set!!!

Paul G.
SN# 090000587 (40GB Green)

Don't get me wrong I am not necessarily mad at anybody. It was just seeming like I went out of my way to set this up with my boss and possbily make a few dollars on the side and I start seeing a post here and there that look like they're saying it's probably not a good idea.
That's what it was looking like to me and when you view it that way I think it would get under anyone's skin.

I appreciate the orders I've gotten so far and would like to get more.

Back to you Paul, I don't know what equipment you have at work but so far I've not noticed any interference in the unit anywhere and the Empeg doesn't bother my computers or network at my shop (It's in the same room), my computer at home (It sits right in between the monitor and the tower) or any of the electronics in my car (of which there's a lot of. I drive a Lincoln Mark VII. It's loaded with electronics). I don't get interference in any of it.

I think the FCC requirements are a lot more restrictive than is necessary for the needs of the genereal public.

Steve

If you want a clear faceplate that's fine with us, although I personally don't like the look of them.

The issue Patrick raised is totally correct - without an IR filter it is rare that the remote control will operate reliably in sunlight. The filter material is a common optical product which passes only light of the appropriate wavelength. This only applies to Mk.1 players - we switched to a different IR receiver for the Mk.2 which has an integral filter.

Rob

Ok, so as far as the Mark I goes I can understand why he said that but like I said before mine operates without a hitch.

Most people are asking for the Mark II anyway.

Steve

Ok, so as far as the Mark I goes I can understand why he said that but like I said before mine operates without a hitch.

Keep your hair on! (something I'm having less and less luck with as the years
pass) I wasn't criticising, I was merely providing a bit of info I thought might be
useful. You may have problems with Mk1 units and filterless panels, but it's easy
enough to fix. Wander down to the nearest good camera shop and order a small
sheet of the appropriate IR-transparent filter material. It generally comes in 6 inch
square pieces. You just cut a bit about 1cm square, and stick it to the inside of the
panel over the IR reciever with superglue. Works a treat.

The stuff empeg used is made by Lee Camera Filters, and from the packet I have
here seems to be a type 87 filter. As I recall, it was about $20 for a sheet, but
you'd get dozens of suitable bits from it.

That said, you may find you don't need it. YMMV.

Patrick.



Opinions expressed in this email may contain up to 42% water by weight, and are mine. All mine.

That said, you may find you don't need it.



Henno
mk2 6 nr 6

$15 of which is what I got my boss to let me use the machine and have the material a piece for plus $5 for my time

Oh, you ruthless capitalist profiteer, you. Making vast sums of money off the backs of us poor working proletariat!

Why, if things go really well, you might make as much as $100 off this project -- almost as much as if you spent your time at McDonalds asking "Do you want fries with that?".

I assume you've already sent off for the Yachting catalogs...

tanstaafl.

"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"

Yatching?
No way.
Custom made personal jet from Leer.

Steve

Custom made personal jet from Leer.

That's Lear. I believe "Leer" makes shells for the backs of pickup trucks.

"...I'm in the hi-fi-delity first class traveling set, and I think I need a Lear jet..."

___________
Tony Fabris

That's Lear. I believe "Leer" makes shells for the backs of pickup trucks.


Well, Bombardier, actually, but Leer would be more within price range, judging by the panel price margin...

Dragi "Bonzi" Raos
Zagreb, Croatia
Q#5196, MkII#80000376, 18GB green

To get things in perspective; an empeg without an ITO coated/wire mesh (mk1) front panel fitted is more along the lines of a PC with the side of the case off in terms of emissions (actually, probably less).

We're not talking irradiating people or causing planes to crash here, just the usual electronic mush that you get out of almost everything nowadays.

Hugo

Damn, I was hoping I could take the front off of my Mk1, point it at the sky and bring down any airliner I liked !

__
Unit serial number 47 (was 330 in the queue)...

I wasn't going to comment but I will now because I have been laughing so hard for so long over this concern over RF leaking because a piece of thinly coated plastic is suddenly gone...c'mon people, we are in the same group of people that hold a radio transmitter to our heads for hours on end while we discuss whatever...isn't this concern a little over-reactionary????? again my opinion only

Technoweenie
12 GB Blue / Red MK2

HAHAHAHAHA! Valid point!!! I sit in a tiny cubicle surrounded by NT / 2000 / Solaris boxes, along with a running Luminglas and lava lamp, and I am worried about a little RF!!! The Luminglas is so bad, if I hold my mouse next to it, it crashes the driver under Win2K!

Paul G.
SN# 090000587 (40GB Green)

Thanks John I needed that.

Steve

Ok gang, sorry about this but I have to up the postage because I will be using the post offices Priority Mail and Global Priority Mail Flat Rate envelopes which are $3.50 Domestic and $5 International.

So it will be $20 for faceplate/lenses
$3.50 Postage for US
$5.00 Postage International.

Sorry but this will make it much easier for me and most likely be quicker for customers as opposed to using ground mail services.

Steve

I've tried twice on your email addy and no luck, I get returned mail.

#695 Mk2 BLUE&GRN&PUR 12Gig

It seems to be working for me.
Oh well.
What can I do you for?

Steve

I hope people here were not actually concerned about RF leakage for health/safety reasons !? I suppose the concern is interference with things like remote keyless entry, alarms, GPS receivers (your own, not on airplanes ) etc.

Dragi "Bonzi" Raos
Zagreb, Croatia
Q#5196, MkII#80000376, 18GB green

I think it is neccessary for us to point out that you are invalidating the products FCC/CE approval and that the responsibility for doing so lies with you. Therefore if it screws with any other electronics in your vehicle (bleeds onto your cellphone, reduces the range of your radio door locking etc) it's your problem not ours.

In practice, as Hugo says, it's probably still better (in terms of emmissions) than most homebrew MP3 players in the car.

Rob

What's your faceplate material? If not glass, could you route that? I'm not familiar with a CNC router. The reason I ask is: I'm dreaming up a very cool faceplate material. It could be on a plexiglas substrate, but may require the rigidity of glass. One aspect I have not yet explored is the custom cutting of the shape (the angel shaped push button cluster seems hard). Might you be interested in routing it if I could get you some stock?

-jim 080000260 w/18G in a Carrera

Well, the material I will be using for the faceplate/lenses is plexiglas and is fairly rigid.

CNC stands for Computer Numerical Control.
It is a flat 4' by 8' table router where the router head movements are controlled by the computer.

The router armatures have the capability to do 3 dimensional routing but since we don't make 3d signs at work the boss did not opt for the modules to let the system do it so whatever I make on it will be pretty much flat.

What exactly did you have in mind?

Steve

with the 3D cutting heads you could make the entire panel out of the one colour! That would look kinda cool. if only you could make the buttons in a similar fashion...

Murray 06000047
I don't think, therefore I am not.

with the 3D cutting heads you could make the entire panel out of the one colour! That would look kinda cool. if only you could make the buttons in a similar fashion...

But, like I said, he didn't buy the modules for it.

Steve

OK I noticed in your original post your addy is 2 different ways, 'darkstorm' in the link and 'drkstorm' for the PayPal addy. I've been trying the first w/returned mail, I've recently tried the latter & will see what happens. If no luck I'll send private. Thanks.

#695 Mk2 BLUE&GRN&PUR 12Gig

For those of us out in empeg land that suffer from the fetish for anodised aluminum screws and allens keys etc is there anything to stand in our way to change the front panal allen keys over to some nice anodised alloy ones and i can save some wieght on my car to ake 0.00001 off the nought to 60 time

I think it was originally planned to do something along those lines with the Mk.1. In fact originally the Mk.1 handle was intended to be anodised the colour of the panel, however the anodising company totally screwed up and all the handles had to be changed to black. With hindsight I think that was probably a good thing.

Rob

What exactly did you have in mind?.

I want to coat a substrate with a few 100nm of durable materials with considered indices of refraction. The materials I'm currently thinking about are MgF2, TiO2, and SiO2 (quartz). I've not yet thought about EMI coating. Due to the rigidity and thinness of the coatings I'm concerned about delamination off of a semi-rigid material like plexiglas. So, can you route glass?

-jim 080000260 w/18G in a Carrera

What kind of glass are you looking for? Optical grade crown would rule! I think it would hold up ok if you wanted to coat it with the TiO2. How are you planning to apply it, and what facilities do you have available?

Sean

What kind of glass are you looking for?

My goal is to have scratch-resistant, anti-reflective, transparent (not translucent) filter with optimal color and darkness for visibility.

I think that the non-A/R blue filter that can with my empeg looks absolutely fantastic indoors. Ideally, I would like to have improved visibility in my car without sacrifising these good looks.

Aside: Hey, I spelled sacrificing with an 's'. I'm turning British from seeing 'synchronising' dance across my display so often. Gimme a nice warm, bitter beer! I'm not kidding; I really want one. Maybe I'll throw some coffee grounds into a Samuel Adams. Darn, Drew Carey already thought of that... :edisA

what facilities do you have available?
I have an appointment next week at a A/R shop that coats eyeglasses. In the meantime I'll try to make some posts and/or set up a web page to show you my current plans towards acheiving these goals.



-jim 080000260 w/18G in a Carrera

Some of the coatings they use on glasses scratch really easily - beware. There are some high quality coatings available though. One was guaranteed not to scratch for up to a year. I dont know if the a/r units will be able to process something that isnt round and not larger than 80mm. There is a process that will put a titanium a/r coating on lenses, but they have only done it on real small lenses so far.

Sean

My goal is to have scratch-resistant, anti-reflective, transparent (not translucent) filter with optimal color and darkness for visibility.

Are you sure it's not for a death satellite? That would have been much more interesting.

___________
Tony Fabris

Well I suppose with the right cutting bits I could but unfortunately I don't have anything of that sort.

The plexi is fairly rigid though. You would have to go out of your way for it to actually bend.

Steve

unfortunately I don't have anything of that sort.
Thanks for the reply. I'll try to find something available near me.

The plexi is fairly rigid though. You would have to go out of your way for it to actually bend.
I hope so! I'd hate to worry about flaking or peeling.

-jim 080000260 w/18G in a Carrera

Alright! You sound like you know a thing or two, which is maybe two more things than me. I do know of a place that layers SiO2, TiO2, and a mixture of the two materials onto glass. They're not local, and I don't like the fact that the residual reflection of white light is VFD green. I don't know if the local guys can do anything larger than an eyeglass lense. I'll see next week...

-jim 080000260 w/18G in a Carrera

Hey, I spelled sacrificing with an 's'. I'm turning British from seeing 'synchronising' dance across my display so often.

Ahem, it's -ize words that are spelt differently in Queen's English, not -ice words. "Sacrificing" is correct on both sides of the Atlantic. Mind you, English English does preserve the noun/verb distinction in licence/license, which US English has lost -- though US English does keep it in many other pairs such as advice/advise, device/devise, practice/practise.

Peter

I apologize for any slight to the mother tongue. Thank goodness I didn't mangle a French word. We'd have to start a new BBS to catch the flames!

-jim 080000260 w/18G in a Carrera

Greetings!

I just received my clear and smoked faceplates for the Mark II. I believe these were the first prototypes, so this may change over time. I was trying to get a good photo, but I am really bad with a camera. I will try again in the morning.

The clear really looks good. You can see the electronics behind the fascia. I have not tried it in full sunlight yet (tomorrow, I guess), but in room light it looks great! The color seems much closer to the dash lighting in my Buick Riviera. If you want to see what it looks like, it is like the natural color you would get without a faceplate. The fit is perfect. Easy to install.

The smoke is also nice, but the fit is not there yet. Different thickness in the stock material. Steve is still working on that. I would personally prefer the smoke a little darker - you can still see outlines of the VFD and components through the panel, but this is just my personal taste.

If anyone is worried about either fit, look or installation - DON'T. The panels were very easy to install (just like the official ones), they look great, they are a lot brighter (less color to absorb the VFD), and I think they are a better match to some US cars.

Paul G.
SN# 090000587 (40GB Clear)

very cool arty shot sadly gives me no idea what a clear disply looks like though but i like it anyway

The elements of the display reflect a lot of any sunlight hitting them.
It really washes out in direct sunlight, but when it doesn't it is very nice!
I haven't gotten around to play with any polarizing filter yet, which might help.

Don't know if the MkII smoke ones are any darker than the MkI's, which
isn't very dark at all.

/Michael - quite happy user of a smoked faceplate on my MkI

if you put polarising on the panel, make sure that it is not the normal to the orientation of your sunnies! Otherwise you wont see a thing!

Murray 06000047
I don't think, therefore I am not.

make sure that it is not the normal to the orientation of your sunnies!

Yeah, and no reading the display with your head tilted 90 degress
either - not that I normally use that kind of posture while driving...

/Michael

All these [censored] fancy solutions... can anyone say tinted windows!!!




Reg #2845: Mark 1 #00173, Mark 2 #119

Yes we can - but if you want to keep driving the car around here, you
can't put effective tint on front door windows or windshield...

/Michael