#9573 - 28/06/2000 13:26
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: Dearing]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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No, not at all. Obviously don't try to sell it to people or distribute it to a member of the RIAA, but other than that go right ahead. The only caveat is that people have to tell me what they like and what they'd like to hear! (This may give me some hint as to what to do the next mix with - hint hint!) Email for preference - paulway@earthling.net. Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9574 - 29/06/2000 06:21
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: PaulWay]
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addict
Registered: 22/07/1999
Posts: 453
Loc: Florida
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Obviously don't try to sell it to people or distribute it to a member of the RIAANo! Not THEM again!!!  Yeah, I'll tell 'em to pass word on to you about what they want/ how they like it. Do you know why it wouldn't fit on a 74 min audio CD? _~= Dearing =~_ "WAY too happy about having #99."
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_~= Dearing =~_
Gettin' back into it thanks to slimrio!
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#9575 - 29/06/2000 14:01
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: Dearing]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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In reply to:
Do you know why it wouldn't fit on a 74 min audio CD?
Not a clue, since I've successfully burnt a copy for my own use... However, I have heard of people having problems with DirectCD where they copied all their information to the disc and then found that in order to make it a CD-ROM they had to have an extra 13MB or so in order to write the table of contents. *shrugs* Dunno. It should be a good two minutes under the limit.
Good luck...
Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9576 - 29/06/2000 14:13
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: PaulWay]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31597
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Your CD-ROM burning/capacity questions are most likely answered here. ___________
Tony Fabris
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#9577 - 29/06/2000 18:14
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: Dearing]
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journeyman
Registered: 07/06/2000
Posts: 55
Loc: Sugar Land, Texas, USA
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Do you know why it wouldn't fit on a 74 min audio CD?
I used music match jukebox to burn a CD. It works great in the car and in my changer at work.
Steve
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#9578 - 02/07/2000 23:08
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: PaulWay]
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journeyman
Registered: 07/06/2000
Posts: 55
Loc: Sugar Land, Texas, USA
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I burned a copy for the car and a copy for my changer at the office. I have listened to it all the way through about 20 times. It's really great while pounding out miles of code. I love that high BPM techno. I'm going to check for good downloads from all of the artists listed.
If you care, I usually skip the first 1m30s of the intro, but I like that "attack formation" part.
When I am working hard and have the mix playing, I don't really register the transition from one piece to the next. In fact, if you didn't include the time/artist listing, I would have no idea how many different pieces are represented in the mix. But there is one that always catches my attention, way off in the middle somewhere.
I took a quick look around on the web for "Paul Way" and "Aleph" and "AlephOne" and didn't find anything. Dose that mean that we have some kind of exclusive here? I can get a cool mix that my friends can't find real easy like? Cool!
What I did find is that Aleph is a hebrew letter. It is used in mathematics for denotation of a transfinite number set. Aleph-null represents any infinite set of objects that can be paired off with integrs. Aleph-One is real numbers, Aleph-two is the set of all functions involving real numbers. (I believe that the set of real numbers inbetween any two consecutive integers is an Aleph-null set.) But, I'm sure you were not looking for a definition, but a guess at how it relates to the mix.
Anyway, I love it and I can't wait for the next (Aleph-two?).
Steve
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#9579 - 03/07/2000 01:36
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: steveb]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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In reply to:
If you care, I usually skip the first 1m30s of the intro, but I like that "attack formation" part.
Fair enough; I feel that bit's a bit loose but I prefer not to start really fiddling around with songs unless I have to. The only vaguely irritating thing for me about that is that I'd love to know where the sample comes from. It sounds vaguely Battlestar Galactica.
In reply to:
Dose that mean that we have some kind of exclusive here? I can get a cool mix that my friends can't find real easy like?
Absolutely - apart from the members of this BBS, only one or two personal friends of mine know about the existence of these mixes. Since I'm borrowing the bandwidth as it is that's probably how it's going to stay. I might put the track listings up on my web page some day, when I get around to it.
Your summary of the Aleph notation is masterly. I didn't know of the Aleph Two classification, though - that gives me a working name for the next one. Since I don't think there's any classes of infinity larger (if you can get your mind around that) than Aleph Two, I'm going to have to come up with other names anyway...
Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9580 - 03/07/2000 03:05
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: steveb]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 21/05/1999
Posts: 5335
Loc: Cambridge UK
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> I love that high BPM techno
That's not high BPM techno, believe me. Paul, got any German gabba techno to mix down? :-)
> Aleph-One is real numbers
Cool, I just thought he knew someone at Aleph One Ltd, a technology company in Cambridge run by some friends of Hugo!
Rob
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#9581 - 03/07/2000 13:34
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: rob]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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Rob said: In reply to:
Paul, got any German gabba techno to mix down?
No. I can't say I'm a fan of stuff faster than 180BPM. However, I am looking to put together a mix from 150 to 170BPM. Infinity One hits a peak of 174BPM at "Bring Your Mind Back Home" by Boo-Boo & Mace.
At this stage it's just a matter of getting all my BPM readings. This is turning out to be more difficult than I'd hoped - bloody stupid programs that can't write text files longer than 64KB!
If anyone has some really good automatic catalogueing programs, I'd be interested to hear of it. I use DiscPlay for my CDs, but need something that can get BPMS as well. Doing MP3 files is almost a must - I'd rather feed it my 15 music bag CD-ROMs than feed it my 200 or so CDs.
My CD listing you can find at http://www.geocities.com/Athens/9791/cdindex.html
Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9582 - 03/07/2000 15:28
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: PaulWay]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31597
Loc: Seattle, WA
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This is turning out to be more difficult than I'd hoped - bloody stupid programs that can't write text files longer than 64KB!Get Ultra Edit. Now. I'd trust my life to that program. ___________
Tony Fabris
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#9583 - 04/07/2000 00:57
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: tfabris]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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Oh, I use the Programmer's File Editor, despite it being somewhat out of date. The problem seems to be that the BPM calculator program, which I licensed so I could get it to output the readings to a file, doesn't like writing a text file longer than 64KB. I don't know why, maybe that's not the case, but it seems to be provoked by the output file size. In other news, I've put the track listings and stuff up on my web site. The PaulWay Infinity Mix track listing is at http://www.geocities.com/Athens/9791/infinity1.html and the Aleph One track list can be found at http://www.geocities.com/Athens/9791/aleph1.html. As usual, you need to mail me to get the actual URLs for the MP3 files themselves. Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9584 - 05/07/2000 04:23
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: steveb]
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new poster
Registered: 09/06/1999
Posts: 7
Loc: Noordwijk, The Netherlands
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>I took a quick look around on the web for "Paul Way" and "Aleph" and "AlephOne" >and didn't find anything. Well, I found this: http://source.bungie.org/[If you don't want to look, "Aleph One" is the name of the open source version of the Mac game "Marathon", a 3rd person shooter in the Doom/Quake style. Wonder if they need a new theme tune.]
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#9585 - 05/07/2000 22:55
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: PaulWay]
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journeyman
Registered: 07/06/2000
Posts: 55
Loc: Sugar Land, Texas, USA
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Since I don't think there's any classes of infinity larger (if you can get your mind around that) than Aleph Two
Well actually, "The set of all subsets of a given set has a larger cardinal number than the set itself, resulting in an infinite succession of cardinal numbers of increasing size." - from encyclopedia britannica
But, I agree that there is no practical meaning to anyhing beyond Aleph-two. It's just a mathematical construct.
Your summary of the Aleph notation is masterly
Thank you! (I'm just assuming that's not a play on my last name 'Bates') Now, I believe your email said "Extra points for guessing the meaning of the title." So do I get the points? And can I use them for a great deal on the next mix? Better yet, can I use them to buy my way up in line (#15066 ouch!).
Which brings me to another thought: I read a post that the Mark 2 does not come pre-loaded with any music. How about pre-loading them with AlephOne?
It sounds vaguely Battlestar Galactica.
I could be Cylons. The first part seems to say "Proceed with visual attack formation". But I can't make out the second part.
Steve
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#9586 - 06/07/2000 00:29
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: PaulWay]
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veteran
Registered: 16/06/1999
Posts: 1222
Loc: San Francisco, CA
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In reply to:
The problem seems to be that the BPM calculator program, which I licensed so I could get it to output the readings to a file, doesn't like writing a text file longer than 64KB. I don't know why, maybe that's not the case, but it seems to be provoked by the output file size.
...Does it allow you to print the data? If so, why not just print to a file?
-mark
...proud to have owned one of the first Mark I units
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#9587 - 06/07/2000 01:18
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: steveb]
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addict
Registered: 09/06/1999
Posts: 483
Loc: Guernsey
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I don't think preloading something like Aleph One would be a popular move with RIAA type people... =)
However, there could be milage in some tracks from somewhere like MP3.com... =)
Jazz
(List 112, Mk2 12 gig #40. Mk1 for sale 4 gig #30, apply within)
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Jazz
(List 112, Mk2 42 gig #40. Mk1 4 gig #30. Mk3 1.6 16v)
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#9588 - 06/07/2000 04:58
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: Jazzwire]
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journeyman
Registered: 25/06/1999
Posts: 57
Loc: New Zealand
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There is plenty of good talent out there that would probably jump at the opportunity to be shipped on the empeg.
But then if musical tastes didn't coincide I guess people might dislike the player because it ships with music that they object to, or less that top studio quality recordings.
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#9589 - 06/07/2000 05:24
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: bryan]
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addict
Registered: 09/06/1999
Posts: 483
Loc: Guernsey
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I agree on both counts... The old demo tune that was shipped with the Mk1 sounded a bit muffled (Although I play it from time to time anyway =). However, with artists on MP3.com and other places looking to establish themselves you could get a better quality mp3 than 128kps off them... =) I know my mate would jump at the chance (quick plug) http://www.mp3.com/shapechangerAs to the styles of music, you could put a range on there, as a demo of how powerful the playlist functions are etc. The music could be selected by the music site themselves, so empeg wouldn't have to. Anyway, I'm sure empeg will have decided if they are shipping music on it and we will find out in time what it is... =) Jazz (List 112, Mk2 12 gig #40. Mk1 for sale 4 gig #30, apply within)
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Jazz
(List 112, Mk2 42 gig #40. Mk1 4 gig #30. Mk3 1.6 16v)
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#9590 - 06/07/2000 06:03
Re: PaulWay Aleph One maths diversion
[Re: steveb]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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In reply to:
The set of all subsets of a given set has a larger cardinal number than the set itself, resulting in an infinite succession of cardinal numbers of increasing size.
Er, well, you'd think so, but not necessarily. For instance, you'd think that a two-dimensional grid of integer coordinates would logically have to be a larger infinity than the infinity of integers. But not so. To prove this, start with the origin, Then, draw a line up to (0,1) and proceeding clockwise to (1,1), (1,0), (1,-1), (0,-1), (-1,-1), (-1,0) and (-1,1). The move one circuit outwards and so forth. Eventually you will form a line - the spiral - which includes all of those points. Thus, the two-dimensional grid is exactly the same order of infinitude (ie. same Aleph number) as the set of integers.
Enumerating infinities does strange things to the consciousness of humans.
Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9591 - 06/07/2000 06:09
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: Jazzwire]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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There's one problem with preloading music that I see. This means that the setup of an empeg car player takes an order of magnitude for the guys at empeg to perform, since each hard disk has to be loaded with more information.
How does it sound to Rob, though?
Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9592 - 06/07/2000 06:28
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: PaulWay]
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addict
Registered: 09/06/1999
Posts: 483
Loc: Guernsey
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I suppose it depends on how the discs are setup in the first place... =)
If they are cloned in some way, then it wouldn't be too hard to copy some tunes in (My Assumption, probably wrong)... If the drives are setup in the empegs, then it would take a resonable amount of time to pump some tunes in, so is probably a bad idea...
Jazz
(List 112, Mk2 12 gig #40. Mk1 for sale 4 gig #30, apply within)
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Jazz
(List 112, Mk2 42 gig #40. Mk1 4 gig #30. Mk3 1.6 16v)
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#9593 - 06/07/2000 11:42
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: PaulWay]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 19/05/1999
Posts: 3457
Loc: Palo Alto, CA
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We can preload music on the soak test rack actually - the units soak for a couple of hours before they're packaged. At this time they're ethernet connected (oh, we love ethernet for testing units :) ) and so we can put stuff on them then.
The current plan is to put a few tunes on the unit. Neil @ Cambridge car audio has some tunes which are probably going onto the next run.
As the Aleph One mix uses a lot of copyright material, I suspect that putting that on the empeg at the factory would be a recipe for disaster...
Hugo
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#9594 - 06/07/2000 14:18
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: altman]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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In reply to:
As the Aleph One mix uses a lot of copyright material, I suspect that putting that on the empeg at the factory would be a recipe for disaster...
May Heaven forefend!
No, I definitely wasn't suggesting the Aleph One mix. Apart from the fact that the whole thing is on that lovely borderline of copyright violation, it's one big file. The next mix I do is also going to appear as a set of individual 'tracks' as well as one complete file and a low bitrate 'trailer' preview - bowing to public demand :-).
I must do a bit of research into how much it would cost to actually license the songs I want to use... Imagine actually being able to publish my own mix CD. Hmmmmmm.
Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9595 - 06/07/2000 14:47
Re: PaulWay Aleph One mix released
[Re: altman]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31597
Loc: Seattle, WA
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The current plan is to put a few tunes on the unit. Neil @ Cambridge car audio has some tunes which are probably going onto the next run.
Did you intend to do a mix of genres? I've got some friends who do some well-produced folk-rock stuff who have already verbally agreed to offer a couple songs for the Mk2 hard disk if you wanted. Contact me via e-mail if you're interested.
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Tony Fabris
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#9596 - 07/07/2000 08:31
Re: PaulWay Aleph One maths diversion
[Re: PaulWay]
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new poster
Registered: 07/07/2000
Posts: 3
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Well, you're both right. Yes, surprisingly, the set of all ordered pairs of integers can be placed into one-to-one correspondence with the set of all integers. But that has little to do with steveb's assertion, also correct, that the members of the set of all subsets of a given set cannot be placed into one-to-one correspondence with the members of that set.
I'll use the set of all integers as a demonstration, but it works for any set. The proof is a reductio ad absurdium.
Suppose there is a one-to-one correspondence between the members of a set, and all possible subsets of that set. For example,
0 -> {}
1 -> {0}
2 -> {all integers}
3 -> {all odd integers}
etc.
Now, for some numbers, the number will also appear in the set with which it is paired. (This is true of 2 and 3 in my example above). Call these members of the set "blue". For others (0 and 1 in my example above), the number does not appear in the set with which it is paired. Call these "red".
Now, consider the set of all red numbers. What number is associated with that set? It cannot be a red number, since red numbers do not appear in the set they are associated with, and this is the set of all red numbers. And it cannot be a blue number, since blue numbers do appear in the set they are associated with, and this is the set of all red numbers! Since our initial premise--that there is a one-to-one mapping between members of a set and all subsets of that set--leads to a logical contradiction, that premise must be false.
©2000 Charles Carroll. Anyone besides Derek Balling may copy this post or parts of it freely.
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#11191, but I'm waiting for the tuner.
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#9597 - 07/07/2000 14:00
Re: PaulWay Aleph One maths diversion
[Re: cec]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/07/1999
Posts: 5549
Loc: Ajijic, Mexico
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Hypothesis: A=B(note: A^2 means A to the second power, or A-squared...) A=B (By hypothesis) A^2 = AB (Multiply both sides by A) A^2 - B^2 = AB - B^2 (Subtract B^2 from each side) (A+B)(A-B) = B(A-B) (Simplify by factoring) A+B = B (Cancel the "(A-B)" factor from each side) B+B = B (Substitution, since A=B) 2B = 1B (Addition of like terms) 2 = 1 (Cancel the "B" factor from each side) Hmmmm.... gives a new insight into the concept of reductio ad absurdium, doesn't it.  tanstaafl. "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"
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"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"
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#9599 - 07/07/2000 21:48
Re: PaulWay Aleph One maths diversion
[Re: tanstaafl.]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31597
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Alright, Doug. I left this for a day and gave the other BBSers a chance. No one bit. So I'm biting. I think the error lies in a division by zero. Somewhere around the simplify-by-factoring step is the algebraic equivalent of a divide-by-zero error. My brain is too screwed up right now to analyze it in detail, so I can't write up a proof right now. Besides, I hhhhhhate algebra. I'm with muzza: Make the bad man stop, mommy. ___________
Tony Fabris
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#9600 - 07/07/2000 23:52
Re: PaulWay Aleph One maths diversion
[Re: cec]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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In reply to:
But that has little to do with steveb's assertion, also correct, that the members of the set of all subsets of a given set cannot be placed into one-to-one correspondence with the members of that set.
Actually, I wasn't denying what steveb said. I'm well aware of that proof. I was just saying that when you're counting infinities the normal common-sense rules don't apply. Hilbert's Hotel is a good example.
I love little diversions like this.
Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9601 - 07/07/2000 23:58
Re: PaulWay Aleph One maths diversion
[Re: tfabris]
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addict
Registered: 03/08/1999
Posts: 451
Loc: Canberra, Australia
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I can't resist biting either...
The error is actually a multiply-by-zero. Remember, A = B, so A - B = 0. At step 4, we say (A+B) * 0 = B * 0, which is pretty much true, but allows us to get away with a bit of arithmetical sleight-of-hand. In fact, in step 3, we've essentially said 0 = B*0, which is true as well, and also causes the same problems.
And no, I'm not sorry at all, especially to my brother :-)
Save the whales. Feed the hungry. Free the mallocs.
_________________________
Owner of Mark I empeg 00061, now better than ever - (Thanks, Rod!) - and Karma 3930000004550
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#9602 - 08/07/2000 00:53
Re: PaulWay Aleph One maths diversion
[Re: PaulWay]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/07/1999
Posts: 5549
Loc: Ajijic, Mexico
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Actually, Tony was on the right track. The cancellation operation (where we cancel out the (A-B) factors on each side is actually a division -- we are dividing each side of the equation by (A-B), and since A-B = 0, we are dividing by zero, which is, of course, an illegal operation. Multiplying by zero is allowable, and does not cause any uncomfortable results. Ain't math fun? tanstaafl. "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"
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"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"
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