I2C Fan Controller for Empeg

Quote:
Does that mean you attached the wire to ONE END of each resistor?

Yes

Quote:
I ASSUME it didn't matter which end?

You assume wrong. Loren was very careful to superimpose arrows on the photo to indicate which end of each resistor the appropriate wire should be soldered. Take another look

Quote:
It looks like you put a jumper on the header and soldered to both prongs, is that correct?

The attached photo shows a close-up of how most jumpers appear. That little copper bridge connects the left-hand pin to the right-hand pin. Apply a little solder to the bridge and make a tiny J loop with the wire. Hook the wire under the bridge then heat bridge and wire together. When hot, apply a little solder to "glue" the wire to the bridge. Don't keep the soldering iron on it too long as the plastic insulation on the jumper and/or wire will begin to melt. It helps to use a soldering iron with a fine tip.

Once cool, you could slide a little heat-shrink sleeving over the jumper if you like and then use a hot air gun (paint stripper gun) or hair dryer to shrink the sleeving. Take sensible precautions to protect your fingers and work area from heat damage!

Once done, you can simply plug the jumper onto both the pins on the mainboard.

Posted by: benjammin

Re: I2C Fan Controller for Empeg - 23/10/2004 14:49

Don't panic on the fan!

I think I got mine here:

http://www.mpja.com/viewallpict.asp?dept=48&main=46

4x40 plastic screws work fine and I got mine at the local hardware store!

I have pics on my website in the Projects section...

If everyone needs, I'll take some hi-rez ones with my better digital camera and make them available.

-Ben

Posted by: loren

Re: I2C Fan Controller for Empeg - 23/10/2004 22:16

So the fan can be a 12v OR a 5v?

Posted by: loren

Re: I2C Fan Controller for Empeg - 03/11/2004 03:25

I got the board... nice work!

Now, could someone who has it installed and working post photos of the install? I'd really appreciate it!

Here's the instructions I have from Ben so far:

V+ is +12
GND is Ground.
Fan + and Fan - are the plus/minus leads from the fan. (12v Fan, of course)
SDA and SCL are the "Serial Clock" and "Serial Data" lines from the processor.
I have a photo of the 2 points in my Projects section... the second to last is
"dark" with highlight areas around the resistors, but it s doesn's say which is
SCL and which is SDA;

SDA can be found on the RIGHT HAND END of the resistor marked 1003 nearest
the top left corner of the strongarm (display board towards you).

SCL can be found on the TOP END of the resistor marked 1003 directly to the
right of the centre mounting hole.

Posted by: mdavey

Re: I2C Fan Controller for Empeg - 03/11/2004 08:46

12v can be found on both pins of the through-hole pad marked Fan, however I'm not sure whether this is regulated or unregulated 12v nor whether the controller is fussy about it. If this is suitable, I'd suggest soldering a 2-pin header through the holes, then soldering the 12v line to a jumper and plugging the jumper onto the header. I don't know of a good place to get GND (that is, so it is easy to undo). You could splice one of the cables or solder onto the back of one of the sockets (perhaps the serial D socket), but most seem to simply opt for soldering a wire to the pad ("collar") around one of the PCB screws.

I thought there was a 2-pin through-hole pad marked I2C or IIC towards one corner of the MK2A board somewhere. Maybe I'm wrong and there is only an IIS pad, not an I2C pad as well.

It might be useful to create a new album on riocar.org with hi-res photos of the front and back of each PCB board including the add-on boards - that would have certainly helped with the creation of the memory manual.

[Edit: fix spelling and clarify]

Posted by: loren

Re: I2C Fan Controller for Empeg - 04/11/2004 02:17

So this fan should work perfect then eh?

I'll try and take some photos this week and ask a few more questions before I go soldering willy nilly. Thanks!

Posted by: mdavey

Re: I2C Fan Controller for Empeg - 04/11/2004 09:21

Check the depth of the fan and the noise rating. I'd suggest a fan with a noise rating of 20-26dB(A). Much less than 20dB(A) won't be worth the probable extra cost unless you are going to modify the shape of the holes in the lid. Beyond about 24dB(A) will be increasingly noticeable in a quiet room or with the engine off. You'll almost certainly need to modify the drive bay if you use a 20mm deep fan. 12mm or 10mm depth will be okay. 6mm deep fans tend to be a bit quieter but have less surface area so can't push quite as much air around.

Posted by: loren

Not workin' - 16/07/2005 22:46

I've had a suspision since I installed this thing that it wasn't working... and I'm pretty dang sure now it's not.

Two reasons:
First, I took the empeg apart, and held the exhaust from my butane soldering iron in the area of the DS1721 temp chip on the I2C board to the point where it definitely was hotter than the threshold I've got it set at... 25 degrees C. No fan movement.

Second, When power is applied to the empeg, the fan momentarily oscillates and then goes still. The center of the spindle gets warm to the touch the longer it's on, and there is resistance to movement when I try and rotate it by hand, more so than when the power is off... like it is fighting same charged poles on a magnet, if that makes sense.

I've metered the obvious points... the board is getting 12V (11V to be exact). I am at a loss as to what else to test, and am a bit peeved I paid for this board when I could just hook the fan straight to 5V and be done with it.

Is there ANYONE who can verify that their board works?? And any help on troubleshooting this is GREATLY appreciated!!!

EDIT: Well... hmm... I put it all back together, and when I plugged the empeg in to AC the fan spun up and is working fine. Color me puzzled!

Posted by: mlord

Re: Not workin' - 17/07/2005 00:11

Mmmm.. I wonder if maybe some stray bits at power-on cause the init sequence to fail once in a while?

When that happens, Hijack outputs "Fan control error; disabling" to the serial console. I suppose it really should do a retry or two before giving up completely, though. Mmmm...

Posted by: woops

Re: Not workin' - 17/07/2005 10:23

I have used the fan controller board for many months now. The hijack settings are such that the fan should come on everytime and the fan used allows me to hear it working when it is on. There is definitely a problem in that (what seems to be randomly) the hijack "fan control error" will show up and the fan will not cut on. I have to reboot a few times until the fan runs. Mlord: Please check that "Random bits at power up" problem you are mentioning. maybe delay that reading or something. (heh: i couldn't program a phone number)

woops

Posted by: loren

Re: Not workin' - 17/07/2005 15:26

Hrm... I've never looked at the console to see if it spit anything out about the fan controller... would it help if I could also prove that is occuring? Thanks for thinkin' about it Mark!

Posted by: mlord

Re: Not workin' - 17/07/2005 15:27

Yeah, if you could prove it's getting that message, then perhaps I'll try a change or two to the code and then have you re-test to see if it helps.

I have a fan controller here, but it is not currently installed in any of my players.

cheers

Posted by: mlord

Re: Not workin' - 17/07/2005 15:34

Mmm.. actually, the existing code seems to try to use a front-panel pop-up message to report failure, as well as the serial console log.

Fan Control Error (displayed for five seconds).

Posted by: mlord

Re: Not workin' - 17/07/2005 15:38

Updated Hijack with fan retries is now here.

Please FIRST verify that you can get the current Hijack to fail with console or front-panel messages as noted in this thread, and only THEN try the replacement. Report back here afterward.

Cheers

Posted by: benjammin

Re: Not workin' - 17/07/2005 15:44

Quote:
the board is getting 12V (11V to be exact). I am at a loss as to what else to test, and am a bit peeved I paid for this board when I could just hook the fan straight to 5V and be done with it.

Figure out if it's working and let me know ASAP (directly please)... we'll figure out something to do from there if you're not happy with it.

-Ben

Posted by: woops

Re: Not workin' - 18/07/2005 14:31

Ben,

I have been curious to ask you: Have you never had any problem with the fan starting? No hijack "Fan Controller Error" messages?

I've tried the 435 hijack mlord just posted and am getting about the same number of random fan starts and fan not starts, i haven't seen the "Fan Controller Error" message though. But i've only started empeg about 12 times in car and @ home. I believe i would have seen that message in 12 starts though.

woops

Posted by: loren

Re: Not workin' - 20/07/2005 03:57

Mark:
I've never received an error message pop up, but I just plugged it up via serial and received this error:

i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed

Then, upon several reboots, it printed out

i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed
Fan control error; disabling

and showed the fan control error popup for the first time (that I've noticed at least, which given it's frequency now seems to point to the fact that I've never noticed it =), so it seems that sometimes it doesn't get to the stage of printing out that error and triggering the pop up.

I'm on Hijack 413 on a MkIIa (no idea why I haven't updated in ages). I've rebooted 15 times at least and it has printed that message every time, sometimes with the "Fan control error" line, sometimes not.

AFTER upgrading to hijack435+, I get the following:

i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: command issue failed
Fan control error, retrying
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: command issue failed
Fan control error, retrying
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed
Fan control error, retrying
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed
Fan control error, retrying
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed
Fan control error; disabling

So now I can't get it to work at all, after about 20 reboots. I guess that one time I noticed it working was a fluke?

Ben:
No worries, I'm sure we'll figure it out.

Again, thanks to both of you for working on this!

Posted by: woops

Re: Not workin' - 20/07/2005 13:50

I just came back from a trip to town. I restarted the car 4 times and the fan came on every time. yesterday the fan worked every time (twice). These are all occurances where the ignition was turned on (not just turn ignition to accessory as when i tested before). Needless to say i'm starting to be very happy with ver 435.

Loren,
If your fan has never worked, then i suggest the wiring is not correctly installed.

woops

Posted by: loren

Re: Not workin' - 20/07/2005 14:26

Quote:
Loren,
If your fan has never worked, then i suggest the wiring is not correctly installed.

The fan HAS worked, just not frequently. I know it worked when I installed it, as is noted way earlier in this thread when I said "wow that little fan can move some air" or something to that effect. I also saw it work a few days back when I took the empeg apart to check all of the wiring. I'm fairly certain it's installed correctly, as the photos earlier in this thread of my install were checked as being correct by Benjamin and others.

Note that I haven't checked it in car with the new hijack however, these tests have all been AC power or in one of Mark's Docks.

Posted by: woops

Re: Not workin' - 20/07/2005 16:13

Loren,

Try some tests in the car. Can you hear your fan working if everything is quite in the car? Also, set hijack so the fan will ALWAYS cut on so you can get a better read on when and when it is not working. I will be interested in knowing what is going on that your fan is not working...so i hope you will keep us posted (pun?)

woops

Posted by: loren

Re: Not workin' - 20/07/2005 16:49

Unfortunately I can't tell if the fan is on in the car as the fan I am using is whisper quiet. Only way would be if I pulled the sled to be able to visually confirm it spinning. I have the temp setting at min 15 and max 18 so it should be on all the time.

Posted by: woops

Re: Not workin' - 20/07/2005 20:39

Loren,

Just for test purposes at least try the RadioShack Part #273-240 40mm 1 9/16" brushless fan.7.7 CFM and enough noise that when music isn't playing you can hear it. I use it and it works well.

woops

Posted by: mlord

Re: Not workin' - 20/07/2005 23:53

Mmm.. Ben'll have to help out with this one. If Hijack cannot talk to it to set the thermostat, then the fan isn't going to spin no matter which model/brand of fan is used.

Mmm...

Posted by: woops

Re: Not workin' - 21/07/2005 17:33

mlord,

can you increase the loop time by a third for receiving fan data bits? I mean the fan works most of the time now and every time using hijack reboot. i can't tell you how much angst this has eliminated.

woops

Posted by: mlord

Re: Not workin' - 21/07/2005 19:32

I don't think the retry loop is useful at all.

But in the meanwhile, I have just now looked at the original i2c code that clocks the bits out, and found something suspicious there that might have an effect. So I've changed it slightly, and the resulting Hijack kernel is here.

Again, try this one out folks, and if it solves your fan problems then I'll incorporate the changes into a proper release.

-ml

Posted by: loren

Re: Not workin' - 21/07/2005 20:00

with Latest Hijack:

i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed
Fan control error, retrying
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed
Fan control error, retrying
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed
Fan control error, retrying
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed
Fan control error, retrying
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write8: device select failed
Fan control error; disabling
player.cpp : 385:empeg-car 2.00 2003/04/01.
Prolux 4 empeg car - 2.1434 Mar 26 2003
Vcb: 0x4089d000

I also wanted to note that yesterday I did a bit of driving and pulled the empeg a few times and never got the fan control error pop up, however I still have no way of knowing if the fan is spinning in car. Is there any reason Car vs. AC would make a difference?

Posted by: mlord

Re: Not workin' - 21/07/2005 20:54

Well, in the car, the player has to visibly pause to output those error messages, because the baud rate is so much slower in car (unless you've up'd it to 115200 in config.ini).

That's about the only difference I can see.

If you're in the testing mood, I'll spin another kernel for you here in a minute or two.. this one SLOWS down the I2C protocol immensely, BECAUSE TALKING SLOW WORKS SOMETIMES FOR FOREIGNERS

UPDATE: Okay, try this.

-ml

Posted by: loren

Re: Not workin' - 21/07/2005 21:08

Heheh, I guess you weren't talking slow enough:

player.cpp : 385:empeg-car 2.00 2003/04/01.
Prolux 4 empeg car - 2.1434 Mar 26 2003
Vcb: 0x4089d000
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write: address select failed
i2c: Failed to receive ACK for data!
i2c_write: address select failed

Notice the different error message however... Thanks for plugging on this.

Posted by: wfaulk

Re: Not workin' - 21/07/2005 21:44

YOU NEED TO MAKE IT TALK LOUDER, TOO!

Posted by: wfaulk

Re: Not workin' - 21/07/2005 21:45

Quote:
I still have no way of knowing if the fan is spinning in car.

Have you tried putting baseball cards in the spokes? Or the computer-fan equivalent?

Posted by: mlord

Re: Not workin' - 21/07/2005 21:51

Okay, I think this proves that Loren's fan controller is either dead, or disconnected.

Cheers

Posted by: loren

Re: Not workin' - 22/07/2005 17:11

Just for the hell of it, I tried again ... and it seemingly worked, no error in the terminal and no pop up.

Rebooted... no error message again. Hmm...

Pulled it out of the dock and stuck straight AC so I can see the fan... No error message, but the fan's not spinning. Same thing, multiple times. The fans jiggles a bit on boot up but that's it. Any further troubleshooting ideas?

Posted by: benjammin

Re: Not workin' - 25/07/2005 17:41

Quote:

I have been curious to ask you: Have you never had any problem with the fan starting? No hijack "Fan Controller Error" messages?

I've tried the 435 hijack mlord just posted and am getting about the same number of random fan starts and fan not starts, i haven't seen the "Fan Controller Error" message though. But i've only started empeg about 12 times in car and @ home. I believe i would have seen that message in 12 starts though.

I have never seen something pop up on my screen until I recently upgraded to the latest (v434 I think) and I had some config.ini issues with the files/dirs options which were no longer valid (but were still listed in the EMPEG FAQ).

Otherwise, my fan works great.... it needs it in my jeep. No A/C.

Loren, you can always mail it back to me and I can test it for you. Verify that the SDA and SCL lines are hooked in the right places.

A condition of "NO ACK" would definitely be an I2C bus issue...

Let me know - Email me directly...

Posted by: benjammin

Re: Not workin' - 25/07/2005 17:48

Quote:

Pulled it out of the dock and stuck straight AC so I can see the fan... No error message, but the fan's not spinning. Same thing, multiple times. The fans jiggles a bit on boot up but that's it. Any further troubleshooting ideas?

Well, to test mine, I just set config.ini to something I know would spin the fan on... and it always worked...

If you do that, and the fan STILL doesn't come on - check that:

1. The fan has +V (you can use a +5 or +12 VDC fan, but I only used +12, so I know that works).

2. The line coming from the DS1721 is logic HIGH (you can use a volt-meter if you want - an oscilloscope is not needed).

if those conditions are met, then only one of 2 things can be it...

1: bad fan.
2: bad MOSFET (2N7002) that controls the fan.

-Ben

p.s. Sorry if my involvement has been random - The grant I worked under here at Univ of IL ended and I've been trying to find other employment as such... you all can email me any time you have a question if I seem non-responsive here...

I was never in the mind-set of getting rich making these controllers.. I just wanted to pay a for the boards and such... you guys need to be happy with working stuff. If it doesn't work - tell me ASAP!

Posted by: Jemmi

Re: Not workin' - 03/01/2006 22:34

Has anyone got an alternate email for Ben? I contacted him about having boards and he said he still had some and then when I asked where to send money all of the emails have bounced back as undeliverable. I hand wired up this circuit utilizing a smd proto board and just get constant fan control error so I think maybe I need to stick with his PC board... but I need to get in touch with him

I2C Fan Controller for Empeg