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#150280 - 25/03/2003 07:57 The newest weapon...
tonyc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
The newest weapon in the war is... SPAM!

From this Washington Post article...


"In attempts to persuade Hussein's inner circle and key commanders to defect, military and intelligence officers have waged "great cell phone attacks" and daily "e-mail probes" in the last several weeks with Iraqi officers and officials. Their names are listed on a giant roster of military commanders that the Defense Intelligence Agency has been compiling for years, according to an intelligence expert with knowledge of the communications. "They've been flooding these guys," said the expert."
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- Tony C
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#150281 - 25/03/2003 08:01 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: tonyc]
wfaulk
carpal tunnel

Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
And, suddenly, Bayesian filtering becomes a munition.
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#150282 - 25/03/2003 08:03 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: wfaulk]
tonyc
carpal tunnel

Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
And, suddenly, Bayesian filtering becomes a munition.
Yeah. Let's just hope they don't return fire with biological weapons, AKA email viruses.
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- Tony C
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#150283 - 25/03/2003 08:09 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: tonyc]
SE_Sport_Driver
carpal tunnel

Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
I have to admit that this one amazed me the most out of all the "new" tacitcs like e-bombs and the like. I mean, if you were a high ranking military officer with your "secure" phone and suddenly you got a call and text message from the enemy wouldn't it freak you out? Esp. considering that cell phones can be used to calculate your location and that ANY conversation you ever had on that phone was most likely recorded.

I hate to admit this, but years ago when text paging was a "new cool" thing I pulled a prank on a co-worker. Him and I both had company issued text pagers that could only be text paged from 2 terminals over at "hq" (or so everyone thought). Him and I were also looking for new jobs over at a competitor business. So I sent him a text message to his pager via email (which only I knew how to do) saying "Reminder: Your phone conversations are monitored. Reconsider your actions." He absolutely FREAKED out. It was one of those pranks that I thought would get a little laugh and it totally backfired. He didn't sleep for days, didn't trust anybody and wouldn't talk to anybody about work unless they came to his apartment and talked in person.

So, these little things can really have a big effect. You expect your bunker to get bombed, but I think you'd assume your cellphone to be secure.
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Brad B.

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#150284 - 25/03/2003 10:31 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
jimhogan
carpal tunnel

Registered: 06/10/1999
Posts: 2591
Loc: Seattle, WA, U.S.A.
I mean, if you were a high ranking military officer with your "secure" phone and suddenly you got a call and text message from the enemy wouldn't it freak you out?

Given that Saddam is unlikely to get $75 billion allocated for this mess, it is conceivable to me that they had to cut some corners and may not have an extensive "secure" phone infrastructure....that they are using their public wireless+wireline networks for many purposes.

Esp. considering that cell phones can be used to calculate your location

If this was as easy in moment-to-moment fact as it is in principle, then US wireless carriers wouldn't find E-911 to be such a bitch.
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Jim


'Tis the exceptional fellow who lies awake at night thinking of his successes.

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#150285 - 25/03/2003 11:08 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: tonyc]
genixia
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/02/2002
Posts: 3411
I just hope they gave Saddam and friends' phone numbers to "Disney Resort LLC" and the like. That would *really* piss them off. Not to mention it would tie up their phone lines for 2 minutes at a time. That would be 'disruptive' technology.
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#150286 - 25/03/2003 11:17 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: jimhogan]
SE_Sport_Driver
carpal tunnel

Registered: 05/01/2001
Posts: 4903
Loc: Detroit, MI USA
Jim, you almost seem bitter that the US has a larger military budget than the Iraqis. It's a fact that the US is a large country with one of the largest populations, largest national resources and hence largest budgets. I also assume that the US government has more tools at its disposal than SprintPCS. It has to be easier when you're tracking just 100 or so phones in something the size of Texas as opposed to Sprint being asked to track millions of subscribors throughout the whole USA.

Which cell phone company came forward after 9-11 and said they'd help find bodies and survivors based on whether or not they had cell phones with them?
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Brad B.

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#150287 - 25/03/2003 11:44 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: SE_Sport_Driver]
jimhogan
carpal tunnel

Registered: 06/10/1999
Posts: 2591
Loc: Seattle, WA, U.S.A.
Jim, you almost seem bitter that the US has a larger military budget than the Iraqis.

No, I just wanted to question the notion that the Iraqui military has some things at their disposal -- like a pervasive, dedicated, secure phone network -- that we take for granted as part of our military capability. I expect they have *something*, but wouldn't try to guess how extensive it is.

If I cynically harp on the new "$75 billion" number, its is just to point out what kind of funds we routinely spend to have these kinds of capabilities. Jeez, I'm turning into a peacnik.

I also assume that the US government has more tools at its disposal than SprintPCS. It has to be easier when you're tracking just 100 or so phones in something the size of Texas as opposed to Sprint being asked to track millions of subscribors throughout the whole USA.

Yes, I expect that there are significant NSA and ASA units sitting in Iraq, Turkey, or Jordan or loitering overhead and, for all I know, can pick out cell calls and triangulate.

Which cell phone company came forward after 9-11 and said they'd help find bodies and survivors based on whether or not they had cell phones with them?

Verizon. My memory was that this was a crude exercise -- ringing up phones. Actual triangulation would seem to be a more complicated exercise -- need to get RF people sitting in a mobile switching center to measure signal strengths in multiple cell sites. I could be wrong.
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Jim


'Tis the exceptional fellow who lies awake at night thinking of his successes.

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#150288 - 25/03/2003 12:21 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: jimhogan]
wfaulk
carpal tunnel

Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
They might have still had mobile triangulation devices around. They can provide more precise estimates, obviously. Of course, I don't even have any idea if they would work with modern mobile phone technology.
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Bitt Faulk

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#150289 - 25/03/2003 13:18 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: wfaulk]
jimhogan
carpal tunnel

Registered: 06/10/1999
Posts: 2591
Loc: Seattle, WA, U.S.A.
They might have still had mobile triangulation devices around. They can provide more precise estimates, obviously. Of course, I don't even have any idea if they would work with modern mobile phone technology.

Good point. Same mobile signal-strength gear (with directional antennae) that engineering folks would use. No reason it wouldn't work on a straight RF signal-strength basis, but no idea how well that would (or did) work in the context of the massive, 3-D WTC site. You've prompted me to some research.
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Jim


'Tis the exceptional fellow who lies awake at night thinking of his successes.

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#150290 - 26/03/2003 04:38 Re: The newest weapon... [Re: tonyc]
g_attrill
old hand

Registered: 14/04/2002
Posts: 1172
Loc: Hants, UK
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