#249584 - 16/02/2005 20:30
Looking for another unusual product
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12338
Loc: Sterling, VA
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Major props to whoever is able to find this one. I'll be super impressed.
We have displays here at the Kennedy Center with little interactive information programs running on them 24/7. They have nothing more than a trackball and a handset for input. However, when they are not in use, there is a sensor that detects inactivity and starts up a screen saver to avoid burn-in on the LCD flat panels. Those sensors are plugged into the game port on the sound card of each machine running the displays. These are very big machines, though, and we would like to replace them with SFF Optiplex machines. The problem is that we can't find a card with a game port on it that will fit in the SFF cases.
So, what would be ideal is a half-height sound card with a game port. Yes, I realize that might not leave much room for the sound ports. So basically it would be a sound card with maybe one stereo output jack, or just a game port card.
Any idea if something like this exists?
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Matt
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#249585 - 16/02/2005 20:34
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 12/02/2002
Posts: 2298
Loc: Berkeley, California
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Perhaps I'm missing something obvious, but what's wrong with a tradtional screen saver activated by lack of mouse movement?
Matthew
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#249586 - 16/02/2005 20:36
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 12/02/2002
Posts: 2298
Loc: Berkeley, California
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#249587 - 16/02/2005 20:51
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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old hand
Registered: 14/04/2002
Posts: 1172
Loc: Hants, UK
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#249588 - 16/02/2005 21:21
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: g_attrill]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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Somehow, I doubt his motherboard has an ISA slot.
It does raise a good point, though. It used to be that you had to attach ports to an empety bezel connected to the actual card via a ribbon cable, which it looks like that card does. Anyone know of a PCI card that works that way?
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Bitt Faulk
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#249589 - 16/02/2005 21:25
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31596
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Quote:
SFF Optiplex machines
Some computers with built-in motherboard sound will also have a gameport connector on the motherboard. I don't know if the optiplex's do or not, but if they do, you don't need a new sound card, you only need the connector assembly that hooks to the motherboard pins. Worth checking into.
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#249590 - 16/02/2005 23:10
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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Turtle Beach still has two PCI sound cards more then capable of fitting in a SFF case with game ports on them. Sadly with Creatives agressive moves, Turtle Beach fell quite hard. It's a shame noone has bothered to notice the non competitive market of sound, especially since now I have no choice but to go Creative for 3D sound in games. I remember a time when A3D was a widly supported choice, and often way better then what Creative had. Sigh, anyhow, I'll end this rant here.
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#249591 - 16/02/2005 23:29
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: drakino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 20/12/1999
Posts: 31596
Loc: Seattle, WA
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Um, yeah, Drakino just made me realize what you were asking, and I think I should point out:
The other thing to remember is that the small-form-factor cases don't prevent you from fitting a regular card. They put the slots sideways on a riser and simply have fewer slots than a full size case. But the slots themselves are standard height and should fit nearly any sound card.
<slaps forehead>
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#249592 - 17/02/2005 01:48
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: matthew_k]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12338
Loc: Sterling, VA
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Thanks for all the responses, guys. Quote:
Perhaps I'm missing something obvious, but what's wrong with a tradtional screen saver activated by lack of mouse movement?
Good question. I'm not completely familiar with the software, but I think that during the program, while there are special videos playing, they don't want the screen saver going.
Quote:
Perhaps a USB one?
Thanks, that's basically what they're looking into, but they're not sure how it'll work with something that isn't a game controller. I'd also just like to add on a personal peeve, that if something converts a game port into a USB connector, it shouldn't be called a USB to game port converter! That's backwards! 
Quote:
How about this?
Yeah, like Bitt said, not many ISA ports on the new machines. Plus, the bezel on that one looks like a full height one. But that got me thinking, I'm pretty sure I've occasionally seen cards with replaceable bezels. I can't remember if they were sound cards or what, but I do remember that.
Quote:
Turtle Beach still has two PCI sound cards more then capable of fitting in a SFF case with game ports on them.
I'll have to do some research to see if I can find info on old models. I wouldn't mind finding some ebay auctions, but we kind of need 8 of them, possibly 16.
Quote:
They put the slots sideways on a riser
Yeah, that's what I would like, but the way these things are laid out, they don't use the riser. It's just the half height cards.
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Matt
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#249593 - 17/02/2005 02:49
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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Quote:
Quote:
Turtle Beach still has two PCI sound cards more then capable of fitting in a SFF case with game ports on them.
I'll have to do some research to see if I can find info on old models. I wouldn't mind finding some ebay auctions, but we kind of need 8 of them, possibly 16.
Those models are all still sold. But looking at your next part...
Quote:
Quote:
They put the slots sideways on a riser
Yeah, that's what I would like, but the way these things are laid out, they don't use the riser. It's just the half height cards.
It very much depends on the SFF case in question. I have yet to see a riser card in a Shuttle SFF case. The slots are simply there like they are on a normal board, waiting for one of the few devices one would need beyond the onboard components. If you need half height cards, that might be a bit tricky, but look into the cheeper sound cards at a place like CompUSA. Last I saw, they had a few $20 "5.1 Surround Sound" boards with a cheep software chip and usually a game port. The Turtle Beach solutions are going to be more normal sized sound cards, unless you can find an old Montego II (I owned the Quadzilla version, and it was mostly half height)
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#249594 - 17/02/2005 03:42
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: drakino]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12338
Loc: Sterling, VA
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Thanks. For some reason I wasn't too specific in the original post. The Dell Optiplex SFF cases are only small width-wise.
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Matt
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#249595 - 17/02/2005 06:45
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5683
Loc: London, UK
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Quote:
The Dell Optiplex SFF cases are only small width-wise.
You mean these fellas?
Yeah, it has a pair of low profile slots -- one PCI-X, one PCI. And the built-in Sound Blaster® Live! 24-bit doesn't have a game port, nor, according to this page does it have any kind of dongle/breakout for adding one.
My google-fu is weak this morning. I can't find any low-profile PCI joystick cards, which is basically what you want, I think. USB might be the way forward.
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-- roger
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#249596 - 17/02/2005 06:48
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 18/01/2000
Posts: 5683
Loc: London, UK
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Quote:
Those sensors are plugged into the game port on the sound card of each machine running the displays.
Usually the game port on sound cards doubles as the MIDI port. Do you know how these things interface? Are they pretending to be joysticks, or are they using the MIDI serial channels?
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-- roger
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#249597 - 17/02/2005 08:17
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/06/1999
Posts: 7868
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You may want to browse Google Image Search to try and find a card that might fit.
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#249598 - 17/02/2005 12:05
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Roger]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12338
Loc: Sterling, VA
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That's the kind of computer, yes. Not all of them have the PCI Express, but they do have normal PCI slots (aside from the low profile part).
Yes, I think you're correct on what I've be looking for. I can't even seem to find any low profile sound cards, so the chances are slim that I could find one with a game port on it. I can't imagine that there'd be enough room for the 15-pin port and any audio jacks. So yeah, I guess that's what I'm looking for.
I don't know what interface it's talking on, unfortunately. I was interested in how it works so I was going to ask one of the guys here about them, but they're a bit busy these days.
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Matt
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#249599 - 17/02/2005 12:38
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Dignan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4180
Loc: Cambridge, England
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Quote:
I can't even seem to find any low profile sound cards, so the chances are slim that I could find one with a game port on it.
Your fu is weak, old man, but yes, none seem to have a game port. There's a picture of exactly what you want on this filth googlebombing site, but sadly it's not a picture of the actual product it's next to.
Peter
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#249600 - 17/02/2005 15:05
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: peter]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3584
Loc: Columbus, OH
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But follow it a link or two further, and you get this
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~ John
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#249601 - 17/02/2005 15:16
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: JBjorgen]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4180
Loc: Cambridge, England
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Quote:
But follow it a link or two further, and you get this
Yes, but again that's the product described, not the product depicted. So it would be useless to Dignan.
Peter
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#249602 - 17/02/2005 15:26
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: peter]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3584
Loc: Columbus, OH
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Click on the "see larger picture" link. Granted, I don't think there are half-size brackets included (have gotten them before with other hardware.) Also note that the picture on the box is different than the linked picture.
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~ John
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#249603 - 17/02/2005 15:39
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: JBjorgen]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 13/07/2000
Posts: 4180
Loc: Cambridge, England
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Quote:
Click on the "see larger picture" link.
OK, so it's even worse than I thought. Both board designs -- the one Dignan needs, and the other one -- have the same manufacturer part number. So it's impossible to tell which one you get. 
Peter
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#249604 - 17/02/2005 16:53
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: peter]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3584
Loc: Columbus, OH
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Found this but doesn't seem to have a game port. USB is probably your best bet.
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~ John
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#249605 - 17/02/2005 17:21
Re: Looking for another unusual product
[Re: Roger]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 24/12/2001
Posts: 5528
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Quote:
Usually the game port on sound cards doubles as the MIDI port. Do you know how these things interface? Are they pretending to be joysticks, or are they using the MIDI serial channels?
Chances are that it's just pretending to be a joystick. If so then find somebody local with a AVR/PIC/PSoC/your_favourite_uC and get them to make a little adapter to plug it into a serial port or USB port.
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