#297077 - 17/04/2007 12:13
Virginia Tech
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old hand
Registered: 17/07/2001
Posts: 721
Loc: Boston, MA USA
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I wanted to see if there are any other Hokies here?
I graduated from this incredibly wonderful school in 1999. Yesterday was very hard to watch. I wanted VT to always be the idyllic oasis that it was for me. I just want the same for all the students that go there. I feel so bad for all involved and my heart goes out to all of them. I love that school with my whole being and I am sick over this tragedy.
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//matt
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#297078 - 17/04/2007 12:53
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ithoughti]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
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I didn't go to VT but I had my application half filled out when I got accepted to Penn State. I was at PSU when this fatal shooting occurred, and though it's nowhere near the scale of the VT massacre, it was still a horrible tragedy. A large, insular college town often feels like utopia to those who live there, and a horrific event like this certainly brings one back to reality.
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#297079 - 17/04/2007 13:22
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ithoughti]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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I had a scholarship to VT, and I was intending to go there until they, for some reason, revoked my scholarship. Still, I went and visited and really liked the campus. Very sad.
However, I am a little irritated at the news coverage.
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Bitt Faulk
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#297080 - 17/04/2007 13:35
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: wfaulk]
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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It's a shame that the possession of handguns on campus is disallowed, otherwise the scale of the tragedy could have been averted. Hopefully this will motivate congress to get rid of the silly "gun-free zones".
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#297081 - 17/04/2007 13:50
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ]
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old hand
Registered: 23/07/2003
Posts: 869
Loc: Colorado
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Quote:
It's a shame that the possession of handguns on campus is disallowed, otherwise the scale of the tragedy could have been averted. Hopefully this will motivate congress to get rid of the silly "gun-free zones".
While I generally agree with you on gun ownership, Billy, I have to say that I find the idea of 1000's of Ugg-and-giant-sunglasses-wearing C-average coeds packing heat may just be one of the worst ideas I've ever heard.
That said, my heart goes out to all the families of the victims, as well as the family of the shooter.
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Dave
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#297082 - 17/04/2007 14:44
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 12/11/2001
Posts: 7738
Loc: Toronto, CANADA
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How many people would have been killed over the past couple of years if students at large carried guns like they carry iPods? Perhaps more than in this single tragedy.
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#297083 - 17/04/2007 14:55
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 17/01/2002
Posts: 3996
Loc: Manchester UK
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Quote:
It's a shame that the possession of handguns on campus is disallowed, otherwise the scale of the tragedy could have been averted. Hopefully this will motivate congress to get rid of the silly "gun-free zones".
That's funny, my university was a 'gun-free zone' and in the three years I was there nobody was shot. Come to think of it, none of the universities my friends went to had any fatal shootings either.
The sooner someone takes the shotgun out of Charlton Heston's cold dead hands the better.
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Andy M
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#297084 - 17/04/2007 15:26
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 13/02/2002
Posts: 3212
Loc: Portland, OR
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Quote:
It's a shame that the possession of handguns on campus is disallowed, otherwise the scale of the tragedy could have been averted. Hopefully this will motivate congress to get rid of the silly "gun-free zones".
Of course, the scale of this tragedy could have been averted if handguns weren't so easily obtainable in the first place. Can you imagine how difficult it would have been to shoot 33 people, when the only weapon at hand is a knife? Hopefully this will motivate congress to get rid of that silly outdated "2nd amendment", and put some real restrictions on handgun ownership.
There... I'll see your stupid "could have been averted" hyperbole, and raise you a stupid "could have been averted" hyperbole of my own.
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#297085 - 17/04/2007 15:28
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: canuckInOR]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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Please don't feed the trolls.
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Bitt Faulk
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#297086 - 17/04/2007 15:30
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: hybrid8]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 13/02/2002
Posts: 3212
Loc: Portland, OR
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Quote:
How many people would have been killed over the past couple of years if students at large carried guns like they carry iPods? Perhaps more than in this single tragedy.
Yes, but as long as it's only one or two people at a time, that's okay... the population at large won't care, or even notice. Kind of like car accidents, you know?
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#297087 - 17/04/2007 15:57
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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Despite my admonition to not feed the trolls, I do feel compelled to point out that the "gun-free zones" (as defined in 18USC922 and 18USC921) cover primary and secondary schools (that is, K-12) only, and therefore have no effect on colleges (unless, obviously, there's a primary or secondary school close by).
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Bitt Faulk
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#297088 - 17/04/2007 16:01
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ithoughti]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 08/03/2000
Posts: 12341
Loc: Sterling, VA
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Very sad indeed. I applied to VT but got in elsewhere early. I've been to the campus, and I can't imagine how difficult it would be to react to something like this when the area is that enormous.
The shooter was from Centreville, VA, which is where my best friend and his wife live. I know it's silly to think about their proximity that way...
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Matt
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#297089 - 17/04/2007 17:46
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ithoughti]
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enthusiast
Registered: 12/05/2002
Posts: 205
Loc: Virginia, USA
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I am also a Hokie Graduate (EE) of the same year as you. 1999. it seems like it has been forever since I was there and it really brought back a flood of memories to see the pictures of the campus. I feel dreadful about this whole act.
As far as gun control is concerned, I think it was just too easy for this guy to get a gun. What is the difference CONCEPTUALLY between this kind of gun freedom and the freedom for a country to develop Nuclear Arms. By the logic stated above, it would seem that if only everyone had Nuclear missiles, war would stop, right? I think that that puts it into perspective a little more. Each gun is like a nuclear bomb to a single person - it might as well be.
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#297090 - 18/04/2007 00:21
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: wfaulk]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 06/10/1999
Posts: 2591
Loc: Seattle, WA, U.S.A.
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Quote:
However, I am a little irritated at the news coverage.
I haven't had the heart to watch/read/listen too much. Irritated in what way?
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Jim
'Tis the exceptional fellow who lies awake at night thinking of his successes.
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#297091 - 18/04/2007 00:41
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: jimhogan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 27/06/1999
Posts: 7058
Loc: Pittsburgh, PA
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Not speaking for Bitt, but, off the top of my head, here's the problem with the coverage, what little I've been able to stomach of it:
1. Anchors, reporters, etc. reporting rumors as facts. You're covering a horrifying, tragic situation. The people involved are shell-shocked. Some of them are telling you the truth, some of them are telling you half-truths, some of them are telling you what their buddy said they saw. Wait until you have confirmation from authoritative sources before you throw something out there that can muddy the waters, confuse those who really need to know, etc.
2. Reporters at press conferences ask the same question six different ways, even though the principals have said they are not going to answer those questions. While I'd love to see that kind of stick-to-it-ive-ness in the White House press corps, it's rather unnecessary from the media circus that's on the VT massacre story. There's a good reason the cops/University officials aren't telling you things, and asking the same question in slightly different styles to try to squeeze a story out of them is not helping the situation
3. Last but certainly not least, pretending this is the only story in the world. It is certainly the most "compelling" story to emerge in the last couple days. It's certainly one that has many elements that make good "news stories." But 33 dead in Iraq probably happens before daybreak. I recognize that after 4+ years of war coverage the American public isn't as "interested" in the stories coming out of Iraq, and I know that the soldiers who are dying there know the risks, whereas the kids at VPI were innocents who had no reason to believe they were in danger. But can we please have some perspective? In an hour newscast, give me 10 minutes on the shooting and 40 minutes of other news that's important, but maybe not as interesting.
So, basically, the same gripes that everyone in America has had about broadcast news ever since it stopped being a loss leader and started being a cash cow.
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#297092 - 18/04/2007 01:40
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: tonyc]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 06/10/1999
Posts: 2591
Loc: Seattle, WA, U.S.A.
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Quote:
....But 33 dead in Iraq probably happens before daybreak. ....
I won't say my question was a set up, but I figured I'd let somebody else say this before me. Yup, "60 dead in suicide car bomb north of Baghdad" has become just another parenthetical ho-hum, I think, along the lines of a bad weather report.
But I do find this massacre really horrible. Perhaps mostly because I think we can expect more. Other countries, Australia and UK come to mind, responded to gun slaughters with measures that were effective (so far, anyway). Sadly, I don't think the US has what it takes to tackle this problem and make this kind of senseless event less likely.
With respect to the other famiar excesses and deficiencies of our media, I don't need much convincing. But I was interested in Bitt's comment (still am). Yeah, would that the press were so pushy and gutsy when it might actually accomplish something (like keep us from wasting tens of thousands of lives elsewhere). But, nope, gotta wait until there is blood in the water and weakened prey.
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Jim
'Tis the exceptional fellow who lies awake at night thinking of his successes.
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#297093 - 18/04/2007 01:50
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: jimhogan]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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#3
It doesn't help that my wife's a sucker for this stuff. If it's sensational, she's all over it. Which is not to say that she's oblivious to the rest of the news. It's just that if this sort of thing happens, the TV is on the news channel all day. Which just makes it that much more painfully obvious that they're not reporting anything else at all.
Edited by wfaulk (18/04/2007 01:54)
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Bitt Faulk
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#297094 - 18/04/2007 03:15
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: wfaulk]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 19/01/2002
Posts: 3584
Loc: Columbus, OH
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I especially like the fact that everyone in the media is looking for a scapegoat since about 10 minutes after it happened. How 'bout just blaming the gunman, hmm?
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~ John
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#297095 - 18/04/2007 04:32
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: JBjorgen]
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old hand
Registered: 23/07/2003
Posts: 869
Loc: Colorado
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Quote:
I especially like the fact that everyone in the media is looking for a scapegoat since about 10 minutes after it happened. How 'bout just blaming the gunman, hmm?
Impossible. As you can see, in America we don't blame the individual for their actions. It's the media and the ability to purchase guns legally that's to blame.
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Dave
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#297096 - 18/04/2007 11:46
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: webroach]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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Or the inability to carry fully-automatic pistols everywhere.
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Bitt Faulk
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#297097 - 18/04/2007 13:27
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: wfaulk]
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old hand
Registered: 17/01/2003
Posts: 998
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Quote:
Or the inability to carry fully-automatic pistols everywhere.
I know most here disagree with Billy's gun toting comment but I think we all can agree it would have been nice if someone (police officer, student, pimp, nun …etc) would have capped the shooter's ass before he slaughtered the lambs.
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#297098 - 18/04/2007 13:33
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: JBjorgen]
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old hand
Registered: 17/01/2003
Posts: 998
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Quote:
I especially like the fact that everyone in the media is looking for a scapegoat since about 10 minutes after it happened. How 'bout just blaming the gunman, hmm?
YES!
There is no personal responsibility anymore. And I’m sure if he had lived and this had gone to trial his lawyers would have blamed his parents, rap or rock music, the school system.. . everyone but the shooter.
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#297099 - 18/04/2007 14:13
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: Redrum]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 25/12/2000
Posts: 16706
Loc: Raleigh, NC US
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Quote:
I think we all can agree it would have been nice if someone (police officer, student, pimp, nun …etc) would have capped the shooter's ass before he slaughtered the lambs.
Yeah. But what's with the macho posturing language?
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Bitt Faulk
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#297100 - 18/04/2007 14:20
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: wfaulk]
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old hand
Registered: 17/01/2003
Posts: 998
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Quote:
Quote:
I think we all can agree it would have been nice if someone (police officer, student, pimp, nun …etc) would have capped the shooter's ass before he slaughtered the lambs.
Yeah. But what's with the macho posturing language?
I thought it sounded good, positive and energetic.
Better than of negative, argumentative and degrading comments.
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#297101 - 18/04/2007 20:15
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: ithoughti]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 06/04/2005
Posts: 2026
Loc: Seattle transplant
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Good, comprehensive read at wikipedia- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virginia_Tech_massacreTruly a tragedy.
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#297102 - 19/04/2007 00:26
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: JBjorgen]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 06/10/1999
Posts: 2591
Loc: Seattle, WA, U.S.A.
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Quote:
I especially like the fact that everyone in the media is looking for a scapegoat since about 10 minutes after it happened. How 'bout just blaming the gunman, hmm?
In a semi-related story...
In 1957 a subsidiary of Pillage Products procured a permit to construct a metalworks factory in the town of Corndog, Oklahoma to manufacture premium knives -- carving knives, throwing knives, et cetera. As construction was completed and knife production ramped up, citizens of Corndog observed that the "factory" was no much more than a huge tin shed. They stormed to the mayor's office asking "Doesn't Pillage know this is tornado country??? That factory is a safety hazard!" To which the Mayor responded "I brought this up with Pillage, but they said that if the town messed with their building permit, they'd hit us with a constitutional lawsuit -- something about the 2nd, 8th or 10th Amendment, 'personal freedom' and 'a taking'. The town can ill afford that. Besides, I'm planning on installing a new tornado siren soon and Pastor Rodney Flash of the First Absolute Church of Corndog has promised that he is going to beef up the church basement to serve as a tornado shelter." The citizens departed, grumbling.
As fate would have it, the Mayor and the Pastor departed the next day for a business development seminar in Oklahoma City.
As luck would have it, no sooner had they settled in at the Motel 6 in OK City when a huge tornado touched down in Corndog. the tornado swept across the Pillage factory, ripped the flimsy roof off and sucked up every knife from the factory floor and loading dock. The tornado then spit out all of the knives in a fair imitation of an AC-130 gunship. Save for the absent Mayor and Pastor, all 2432 residents of Corndog were killed.
Hearing this news early the next morning, the Mayor and Pastor abandoned the seminar and drove furiously back to Corndog at speeds, say some, in excess of 91MPH. But the OK City satellite news trucks were already in place at Town Hall when they arrived. As they de-SUVed, the Mayor and Pastor were assaulted with a strident, screeching cacaphony of questions from the pack of rabid media wolves:
What about the flimsy factory???
What about the tornado siren???
What about the tornado shelter???
To which they Mayor adroitly responded: "I think we need to examine the tornado's responsibility here!!"
And which the Pastor quickly seconded: "You can rest assured that tornado is burning in Hell."
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Jim
'Tis the exceptional fellow who lies awake at night thinking of his successes.
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#297103 - 20/04/2007 16:01
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: JBjorgen]
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old hand
Registered: 17/01/2003
Posts: 998
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Quote:
I especially like the fact that everyone in the media is looking for a scapegoat since about 10 minutes after it happened. How 'bout just blaming the gunman, hmm?
I think everyone here will agree...
This guy is a NUT!
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18220228/
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#297104 - 21/04/2007 01:32
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: jimhogan]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 19/09/2002
Posts: 2494
Loc: East Coast, USA
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As Jim so ellegantly put it: if you ban guns, people will still get them. The best way to fight gun violience is not to be Big Brother like the UK (sorry guys), but to attack the manufacturers and distributors. Give them a taste of their own medicine, eh?
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#297105 - 21/04/2007 01:37
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: Redrum]
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pooh-bah
Registered: 19/09/2002
Posts: 2494
Loc: East Coast, USA
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From Redrum's link: Quote:
"It disgusts me," said Isaiah Triforce Johnson, a longtime gamer and founder of a New York-based gaming advocacy group...
Clearly, Johnson's PARENTS were also longtime gamers; poor kid.
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#297106 - 21/04/2007 09:39
Re: Virginia Tech
[Re: FireFox31]
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carpal tunnel
Registered: 17/01/2002
Posts: 3996
Loc: Manchester UK
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Quote:
As Jim so ellegantly put it: if you ban guns, people will still get them. The best way to fight gun violience is not to be Big Brother like the UK (sorry guys), but to attack the manufacturers and distributors. Give them a taste of their own medicine, eh?
Where's your proof that banning handguns in the UK hasn't worked? If guns aren't available 'over the counter' then other than going to the nastiest neighbourhood in town and asking the nearest betracksuited youth where you can buy a gun without having the sh*t kicked out of you, how are you going get your hands on one? Ebay?
I think if Cho had lived in this country it wouldn't have happened.
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Andy M
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