Hi,

I don't have an empeg yet, but I'm on the registration list (on the ass end of course :) ).

I was curious to know how the songs are transferred to the empeg. I have my music collection in MP3s stored on a few CDs. When I get my empeg, if I want to transfer the songs to the empeg, can I transfer them from CD or do they all need to be pooled together before they can be transfered?

After the songs have been transfered to the empeg car and a week later I want to transfer more songs, does the entire collection have to be retransferred or just the songs you want to add?

I looked around, and couldn't really find any details on how the emplode software works. Sure would be nice to see an example of it in operation. :)

Thanks

When I get my empeg, if I want to transfer the songs to the empeg, can I transfer them from CD or do they all need to be pooled together before they can be transfered?

In theory, you can transfer the songs directly from the CDs to the Empeg. You can do it in as many or as few batches as you like. Just drag and drop the files from the Windows Explorer. The only thing is that you can't switch CD's in the middle of a file transfer. There's no function for having it prompt you for the next disc. So you'd just have to do it one CD at a time.

However, I'd recommend copying your files to the hard disk first, before uploading them. CD-ROM drives are notorious for having wildly fluctuating transfer rates, and the uploading software isn't particularly tolerant of such things. Has anyone else on this BBS successfully transferred a large amount of files directly from a CD-ROM to the Empeg? Did it work or did you get synch errors?


After the songs have been transfered to the empeg car and a week later I want to transfer more songs, does the entire collection have to be retransferred or just the songs you want to add?

Just the songs you want to add. The management software (called "Emplode"- cute name, huh?) is very efficient. It allows you to change and edit the contents of the Empeg interactively, and then "synchronize" those changes all at once. So, for instance, you can drag a thousand songs onto Emplode, rearrange them, rename them, edit their tag data, copy them into different playlists, delete some files, etc. Then, when you're all done with all that editing, you hit one button and it churns away at the Empeg making all those changes in one big batch. As part of those changes, it uploads whatever new songs you've added. Depending on how much new data you've added, you can either wait a minute for it to get done, or you can go have dinner and come back to it later to see if it's finished.

Something that's particularly neat about Emplode is that it doesn't require anything to be stored on your local computer. It gets all of its playlist and song data directly from the Empeg's memory. It's sort of like a "dumb terminal" for the Empeg. You can't even run it without the Empeg connected. What this means is that you can manage your Empeg files and playlists from any computer without having to worry about synchronizing the data between different computers.


I looked around, and couldn't really find any details on how the emplode software works. Sure would be nice to see an example of it in operation.

Darn- I just did a detailed, annotated screen shot of it for Doug Burnside in a private e-mail, but I don't have it with me to show you. Doug, if you're listening, can you send it back to me so I can post it here?

Tony Fabris
Empeg #144

Darn- I just did a detailed, annotated screen shot of it for Doug Burnside in a private e-mail, but I don't have it with me to show you. Doug, if you're listening, can you send it back to me so I can post it here?

Check your mailbox Tony -- it's there now even as I write this!

tanstaafl.

"There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch"

I looked around, and couldn't really find any details on how the emplode software works. Sure would be nice to see an example of it in operation. :)

Okay, Kureg, here's the relevant information from the e-mail I sent to Doug. Basically, Doug's planning on getting a Mark 2 and, like you, was curious about how the software and the playlists worked. Since I already own a Mark 1, I was answering his questions. So here it is:



>As I understand it, I can establish primary indices (i.e.,
>"playlists") based on a limited number of variables -- probably
>things like artist; title; album; year; genre; and no doubt a few
>more, including some that I can define for myself.

Nah, not really. The playlists are completely freeform, they are not dependent upon any variables. They're a lot like creating folders in Windows Explorer. All you really do is name them, and you can name them anything you want, and put any songs you want into them.

Now, it just so happens that I have playlists that are organized by album and artist, but that's just because I named them that way, not because of any inherent variables.

The variables you listed (artist title album year genre) are the only variables attached to the songs, there aren't any more (well, there's a comment field but it's not used by the Empeg). They are part of the MP3 file format. You can't (at the current time) define your own variables.

Note that you can perform searches on those variables, but that's a different function than the playlists.


>There appears to be no limit to the number of separate
>playlists I can establish. So I could have, say, ten songs
>distributed in three playlists: (...)

Yes, your description of how you can mix and match songs in different playlists is fairly accurate. Personally, I don't make mine that complicated, but you certainly can if you like.


>Above (and containing) those nine playlists, would be a
>playlist called Classical. On the same level might be
>other playlists for other genres, like Rock, Jazz, Country,
>Reggae, Rap, and Blues.

Yes, you could do that. But it doesn't have to be arranged by genre. The structure is totally arbitrary. For instance, in Chip's video, he had one called "80's stuff". The playlist wasn't created on a "year" variable, he just named a playlist "80's stuff" and dragged his favorite 80's songs into it.


>Above those seven might be two playlists defined as Vocal
>and Instrumental.

You could organize the tree that way, yes, but then you'd probably be making the navigation too "deep" to be useful. How you organize the playlists is up to you, but I'd recommend against going more than a couple levels in depth.


>Above that might be root.

Right, and the "root" represents everything on the unit. Notice how on Chip's video it has that little "triangle"? That's the play button for that "level". If you hit "enter" on that triangle at the root level, it plays every song on the unit. If you scroll left or right to another playlist and hit "enter" on that playlist name, you'll be given another menu of the songs and the sub-playlists in that group. It will also have a "play" button, where hitting "enter" there would play that section of the playlist tree. And so on down the tree.

As you can see, if you make your playlists too complicated, it would become difficult to navigate.


>There appears to be no limit to the number of
>subcategories that can be defined under each division.

Right. The only limit is your tolerance for navigating sub-trees while driving. :-)


>The real art will be defining and setting up the
>playlists. I think it will be very important not
>to be in a hurry here. "Measure twice, cut once" type
>of mentality will be required.

Not really. It's so brain-dead easy to reorganize the playlists that you can set them up any way you want and change them later to suit your tastes.

It's really not as difficult as you think, and doesn't require as much forethought as you're giving it. I was a little concerned about it when I was waiting for my Empeg to arrive, and when actually got it, I saw that I was worrying for nothing.


>What I don't understand is how I make the playlists -- the actual
>physical button pushes required.

Ah. It's real easy. I'll describe it...

(Refer to the attached screen shot file for reference.)



When you run the Emplode program, the first thing it does is polls the USB port for the Empeg and downloads the playlists that are currently on it. Emplode won't work unless the Empeg is plugged in. All playlist info is stored ONLY on the Empeg itself.

Once it's downloaded the playlists from the Empeg (takes about five seconds), it displays the playlists in a windows-explorer-like interface. There is a tree-list on the left pane, with all the playlists shown hierarchically. Once you double-click on a playlist, the right pane displays the songs and/or sub-playlists.

Creating a playlist is a lot like creating directories in Windows. First, you select the parent location where you want the playlist to go. For instance, if I were going to put my remastered copy of Permanent Waves on the Empeg, I might start by selecting my "Rush" playlist. Then you hit Edit/New Playlist on the menu. A box appears allowing you to enter the name for the new playlist. For instance, I might enter "Permanent Waves (Remaster)" in the box. Press Enter, and the playlist is now ready to drop tunes onto it.

To add new tunes to the playlist, you drag and drop them from Windows onto the playlist in Emplode. To copy tunes from another location in the Empeg, you drag and drop the same way, you just do it within the Emplode program. You can also use the cut/copy/paste commands inside Emplode if you're not good with dragging and dropping.


>Then, how are the playlists transferred to the empeg?

Playlists, edits to playlists, and songs are all transferred with one command- the "Synchronize" command. It's on the File menu, or, referring to the screenshot, it's the little red arrow button on the left end of the toolbar.

Any changes you made in Emplode (whether they be additions, deletions, changes, etc.) get reconciled when you hit that button. Since beta 10, it's even STABLE and actually WORKS. :-)


>Suppose that I want to take a song out of the String Quartet
>playlist, and make a new playlist called Chamber Music and put
>that song (and several others) there instead? Do I keep my
>"master" playlist on my Windows machine, keep it updated there,
>make the changes there, and then when the whim hits me do I use
>emplode to replace the whole playlist structure in the empeg?

As you may already have gleaned, you do not maintain a master playlist on the Windows hard disk. Emplode is just a dumb terminal, reporting and editing the playlist structures stored directly inside the Empeg unit itself. This has the advantage of allowing you to edit the Empeg at any computer. I perform edits both at work and at home, and I don't need to worry about keeping the playlist structures synchronized between the two machines because there's nothing to synchronize- it's all stored on the Empeg.

Okay, on to your specific example:

The first step would be to create the new "Chamber Music" playlist. Then you would select the "String Quartet" playlist and scroll the right-hand window pane so that you can see the song within that playlist. Then, scroll the left-hand window pane so that you can see the new "Chamber Music" playlist in the tree.

Then simply drag and drop the song onto the "String Quartet" playlist.

By default, it will MOVE the song from one playlist to another. If you want to COPY the song instead (so that it ends up in both playlists), you hold down the Ctrl key while doing it.

See? It's just like Windows Explorer.


>suppose I want to listen to Mozart Concertos. I don't have a
>playlist defined for that. I have a Mozart playlist defined. I
>have a Concerto playlist defined. But not a Mozart + Concerto
>playlist. Is there a way to create such a playlist on the fly
>within the empeg?

No, there isn't. The only way to create playlists is with Emplode. But you could just hit your Mozart playlist and press the >> button every time a non-concerto comes up. :-)



Tony Fabris
Empeg #144

Great! This and your other post were exactly what I was looking for. Fantastic. Thanks a lot.

Well done, Tony!

( Now Hugo only needs to copy the lot into his new operating manua; ;) )

Henno
# 00120

Wow Tony,

Great description. One question though... So you create a new playlist, or album name --- then you move the .mp3 files into that "folder" or playlist. How does Emplode know the proper order of the songs on the album? I'd want to keep all of the songs on each album in their correct order. Does it automatically sort alphanumerically? That would make sense...

So, the file:

Rush - Power Windows - 01 - Big Money.mp3

would automatically come before:

Rush - Power Windows - 05 - Another Song.mp3

Right?

- Jon

how come people still hold on to the last vestige of CD's. track numbers and orders. I let that go a long time ago. It's like extra information you don't need anymore. Reorder those songs the way YOU like them!

I understand a few albums i guess need to be played in order , but i don't like artists that put that much thought into their album production :)


Empeg Kicks Ass
S/N 00203
http://www.iretro.com

How does Emplode know the proper order of the songs on the album? I'd want to keep all of the songs on each album in their correct order. Does it automatically sort alphanumerically?

That is an incredibly good question. Sorry I didn't cover it before. As far as actual play order, it does not sort alphanumerically.

Okay, in the screen shot, you can see a column labeled "position", right?... If you click on any of those column headers, the displayed list will be sorted based on the column you clicked on. If you sort on "position", then you can drag the songs up and down in the list and the positions will be renumbered. That's how you can re-order the tracks. The Empeg will play the songs in order of position if "Shuffle" is turned off.

Now, when you're first dragging your songs onto Emplode from Windows Explorer, there's a trick you can use so that they get into the right positions to begin with. But it's complicated and involves learning a little bit about how the crack-addled programmers at Microsoft wrote Windows Explorer. Remember that it's a real snap to re-order the songs in Emplode by hand, so the procedure below is not necessary. But it's interesting.

To begin with, understand that Emplode sorts the songs based on the order they're added to emplode, not the order they appeared in Explorer. So if I want to drop them onto Emplode in order, I can do it one of two ways:

1) I can drag and drop them onto Emplode one at a time in the correct order.
2) I can group-select them and drop them all at once.

Method 1 works every time. Method 2 is screwy because the Microsoft programmers smoke too much crack. When you drag and drop a group of files from Explorer, it doesn't order them the way you see them on the screen. It orders them the way you selected them! And not only that, it's in reverse order, with the top of the buffer being the file your mouse was on when you began the drag operation.

So if you select them from the top down, then grab the middle file to begin the drag, you'll put them in reverse order with the "grabbed" file being completely out of the order.

Here's how to properly group-select files in Windows Explorer so that they remain in "screen" order during a drag-and-drop:

1) Click to select the LAST file.
2) Hold down Shift and use the "up arrow" key on the keyboard to group-select up to the FIRST file.
3) CAREFULLY click and hold on the ICON (not the file name) of the FIRST file, then drag that group to its destination (in this case, the Emplode window).

If you do this exactly, they will drop onto Emplode in the same order as they were on the Explorer screen.

(At least I'm pretty sure that's the way you do it. I wanted to double-check this in Emplode but I'm getting the strangest error message all of a sudden. I think I need to reboot my system.)

Tony Fabris
Empeg #144

Oh, and I forgot to mention...

The remastered Power Windows is excellent. All of the Rush remasters are really good. Check them out if you don't own them already.

Tony Fabris
Empeg #144

Thanks again Tony!

Good info! BTW, I have NO idea why I thought of using Rush's Power Windows in my example... I haven't listened to it in years, but all this chat has caused me to re-visit that disc. Love it.

Secondly, I don't think song order is as arbitrary as some people think. I have a feeling that a lot of groups are very interested in what order their songs are ordered on a CD. If I really want to listen to a favorite album, I like to listen to it in the order it is on the CD. Call me old fashioned!

Also, what a pain, but I'm now re-ripping all of the CD's that I had already ripped due to the discussion about CBR vs. VBR. Argh!

- Jon

Secondly, I don't think song order is as arbitrary as some people think. I have a feeling that a lot of groups are very interested in what order their songs are ordered on a CD.

For certain albums, yeah. I wouldn't imagine listening to Power Windows or Moving Pictures in anything but their original order. But for some albums (Signals, for example), I couldn't care less what order they're in. Pink Floyd albums are hard-coded to be in a certain order, of course...

If I really want to listen to a favorite album, I like to listen to it in the order it is on the CD. Call me old fashioned!

One thing that the Empeg does is change the way you listen to your music. It's designed around being able to hear your entire collection shuffled (although you can listen sequentially, too, or shuffle just one album like a CD player if you want). I used to think that it would be sacrelige to listen to one song from Moving Pictures without listening to the entire album sequentially. Now I'm not so anal about it.



Tony Fabris
Empeg #144

great stuff Tony, there is one more method to select songs.
Open the directory in Explorer and Select All. This always gets the songs in the correct order. You can the Copy and Paste them into Emplode.
If you didn't want all of them, delete them from emplode now.

I don't think the MS programmers are just on Crack.

____________________________
Murray

Interesting. Since the mouse-selection stuff was so screwy, I never thought to try the menus.

Are you sure that "Select All" selects them by screen order and not on-the-hard-disk order?

Tony Fabris
Empeg #144

Pretty sure. Although using Audiocatalyst to do it sequentially all the time is my main mode. I don't think I can be bothered doing a 'scientific analysis' of the process.
I can do additions easily by using keyboard shortcuts and mouse clicks.

1 - select music Dir in Explorer
2 - CRTL A, CTRL C
3 - ALT TAB to Emplode
4 - create playlist
5 - CTRL V
...
n - sync.

easy


____________________________
Murray